← Autodidact Archive · Original Dissent · Okiereddust
Thread ID: 9387 | Posts: 13 | Started: 2003-08-29
2003-08-29 15:16 | User Profile
[url=http://www.sfgate.com/cgi-bin/article.cgi?file=/news/archive/2003/08/15/financial1354EDT0137.DTL]SF Chronicle[/url]
SUDBURY, Mass. - Tom Calderini used to supervise three teams of software programmers spread across two states and an office overseas, but that job never tested his "people skills" quite like this.
"Sorry," an apron-clad Calderini says gently, addressing the mother of a girl in purple flip-flops whose head is barely level with his new workstation -- the counter at the local Starbucks. "We're all out of blueberry."
Spoken like a true survivalist in a job market that calls for desperate measures.
Desperate, but increasingly familiar to scores of workers who, unable to find jobs equal to well-paid white-collar positions they lost in layoffs, are grasping at survival jobs offering considerably less.
Since early 2001, the economy has shed about 2.7 million jobs, stranding workers from the stricken information technology and telecommunications sectors and the broad ranks of middle management thinned by corporate cost-cutting.
In the 1990s, those jobs were the prizes of the New Economy, offering substantial paychecks, stock options, and generous benefits, along with the promise of hopscotching to something even better.
But that's all a memory, and many displaced white-collar workers driven by frustration and money worries are settling for work as food servers, security guards and retail clerks.
"A lot of people are going into auto sales or working at The Home Depot," said Larry Elle of Success Associates, a Boston-area job counseling agency. "They're kind of grasping at straws."
For some of those survival-job takers, "there's a lot of shame and embarrassment in doing it because it's a feeling of going backward," he said.
The attraction is largely financial -- a paycheck to cover bills and, in the best cases, employer-subsidized health insurance. But for some, at least, it's also about the need to do something, anything, to again participate in the working world.
That doesn't mean finding such a job is easy. Calderini, a 41-year-old father of two who used to make about $80,000 a year, was indignant after being turned down for work at a home improvement store, an upscale grocery store and an outdoor gear shop.
Now he vacillates between praising the Starbucks job -- it offers health insurance and a chance to meet people who might be a link to another career -- and voicing a certain queasiness, not unlike a ballet dancer forced to dance for tips in a stripjoint.
"Some days I say I can't believe I'm doing this, getting up at quarter to five to go sell coffee for not very much money," says Calderini, of Marlboro, Mass., a bedroom community between Boston and Worcester. "But If I give up on this, it's almost like I've given up altogether."
It's hard to know just how many workers like Calderini have taken survival jobs -- since they're working again, they're not reflected in the unemployment rate -- but their ranks are swelling.
The shift is hinted at in figures tallied by the federal Bureau of Labor Statistics showing that about 4.7 million people who want to work full-time have settled for part-time jobs because of economic conditions, nearly a 50 percent increase from three years ago.
The willingness to settle reflects the difficulty of finding equivalent jobs. The time the average jobless worker remains unemployed has stretched to more than 19 weeks, up from about 12 weeks in early 2001. More than one in five jobless workers -- about 2 million people -- have been out of work longer than half a year.
But many workers settling for lower-paying jobs have been searching for much longer.
Take Herman Gold, who lost his job as a project manager for a consulting company at the end of 2001. When months went by without a nibble from potential employers, Gold took a job as a clerk in a Kinko's photocopy shop near his home in Naperville, Ill.. a Chicago suburb. He left that job for another as an office administrator at a used car dealership, working 20 to 30 hours a week.
Gold says he thought of himself as an isolated case until he went to a networking meeting at the local library in March and sat next to an unemployed electrical engineer.
Gold was impressed to hear the man had received 17 patents in his years at Lucent Technologies. But the man was focused only on getting out of the meeting by noon so he could grab some sleep before rushing off to a third-shift job as a stocking clerk in a warehouse.
"It turned me into saying, 'Hey wait a minute. What's going on here?"' Gold recalls.
Such an account would not surprise Cary Coovert, who lost his job as a software engineer in late 2001. This May, he finally gave in and took work as a security guard, patrolling an office and retail complex in Cambridge, Mass.
It means that each Friday night, Coovert puts his two daughters to bed before changing into a uniform so he can work through the weekend on the 11 p.m. to 7 a.m. shift. The job pays $9.25 an hour, and Coovert figures he now makes about a third of what he did in his past life.
"I'm ashamed to be in the situation I'm in," he says. "I feel like I wasn't watching the business. I wasn't watching the economy. I feel like I wasn't paying attention. I'm not sure anybody was paying attention back in the '90s."
The transformation of the labor market has stunned many jobseekers, says Sharee Wells, an adviser in the Tulsa, Okla., office of career counseling agency Bernard Haldane Associates, which has seen many of its clients take survival jobs unrelated to previous careers.
"It's extremely difficult for young people who didn't know anything else, who have never known hard times and think they're very valuable just because they're on the planet," she says. "The folks who are older have a tendency to get more anxious or desperate about being able to maintain their lifestyles, ... respectability in the community, and things like that."
Some survival holders see a silver lining in all this.
Andy Massa was making $130,000 a year when he was cut from an executive job with a software subsidiary of Group Bull in late 2001. Since then, he's sold jewelry in a department store and worked as a cashier at a ski slope, both at $8 an hour. An avid golfer, he's moved on to jobs related to his hobby -- one helping run the pro shop at a local golf course, another selling golf equipment in a mall sports shop.
"It's a lot simpler and less challenging than it used to be, but I've learned to be humble," says Massa, of Hudson, Mass.
"I see guys coming on to the golf course wound pretty tight. They're guys who come in and are late
2003-08-29 19:41 | User Profile
I graduated from b-school in May, and my class had 60% unemployment.
Worst in history of the program (50 years old), and two years ago it was 2% with no offers.
So I am closing on a small business I've financed with savings and investor help. I'm not going quietly into the night but....I've got a lot of angry classmates. I usually chirp in with ,"Well, at least there are 1M foreign IT workers in the USA now"
AHAHAHA :taz:
2003-08-30 03:39 | User Profile
Interesting [url=http://www.libertyforum.org/showflat.php?Cat=&Board=news_business&Number=845823&page=&view=collapsed&sb=5&o=21&part=1&vc=1&t=-1]Liberty Forum Thread On This[/url] also.
For an critique of the industry and business-libertarian immigration propoganda that created this situation, see [url=http://heather.cs.ucdavis.edu/itaa.html]Professor Norm Matloff's 'Debunking the Myth of a Desperate Software Labor Shortage'[/url]
2003-08-30 04:02 | User Profile
Originally posted by new and improved@Aug 29 2003, 20:49 * *Jay -
Best of luck in your new venture! ** Seconds on that
Is there a forum where these struggling grads go online? I'm looking for a way to turn more people on to the OD forum. Young men who are experiencing first hand the effects of their own planned dispossession will be receptive to what is discussed here, in my opinion.
If there is, I don't know of it. That's really the big story in this that isn't emerging, but its not a simple one. Quite simply the students and hi-tech workers impacted by this in general are in general politically incompetent, and unable to even articulate a coherent response to this problem and the issues involved, to say nothing of organizing an effective counter-action. Why might be some of the subject we're trying to address with forums like this.
In general though, for reasons like this and others, there hasn't been a whole lot of organized action, considering the nature of the problem. Even the tech workers getting laid off have just recently taken steps to organize a union. John M. Miano (miano@colosseumbuilders.com) of the Programmers Guild is one of the leaders in this effort.
In general though these unionizing efforts of course shy away from some of the more overtly political issues. They do quietly get into immigration, but in a non-political way that stays away from some of the more ideological issues such as the diversity bias in our opinion making institutions (education and media) that in a fundamental way helped create this mess in the first place.
Students in particular don't seem to have a permanent edge to their anger. From what I've read, its their parents who are raising more of a stir. (They're the ones paying the bills after all, and having to deal with kids coming back to live at home, etc.). That's my feeling at least, if you find something more let me know.
And if you ever do serve Rban an espresso, make sure you know lye from sugar. Please see "the Pope of Greenwich Village" for more on this subject.
I haven't heard much of rban's "let the lazy bums kiss Indian H1-B ass" lately. Maybe he isn't so smug, knowing there are probably a few of these laid-off techies who would love to track him down - I don't know.
2003-08-30 15:30 | User Profile
Jay -
**Best of luck in your new venture! **
Thanks! I think it'll work out well.
Is there a forum where these struggling grads go online? I'm looking for a way to turn more people on to the OD forum. Young men who are experiencing first hand the effects of their own planned dispossession will be receptive to what is discussed here, in my opinion.
I've wondered the exact same thing. What I can tell you is, with lots of talented college and grad-school people having nothing to do right now, a lot are on the internet. Many want answers. So I just say, "Well at least 1M foreign IT workers are in the USA now" and some perk up their ears a bit. You have to start slow.
**And if you ever do serve Rban an espresso, make sure you know lye from sugar. Please see "the Pope of Greenwich Village" for more on this subject. **
I don't acknowledge him on this forum, so I doubt I'd do so on the streets. I'm never going to be serving lattes, anyway.
-Jay
2003-08-30 16:52 | User Profile
One of the reasons why IT workers or engineers are slow to unionize is because they compete with one another for salaries/bonuses and because there is no clear line dividing "workforce" from the employers (at least in small-to-medium size companies). Your manager, manger's manager etc. all the way up to the CEO are often working stiffs just like you. There is a wide range of compensation for the people on the same hiearchical level too, would you talk to a "loser" about unionizing while being taken care of?
Only in the conditions of flat wages and monotonous work, where the most commoditized IT work is heading for anyway, organization of the proletariat is possible.
2003-08-30 18:47 | User Profile
Originally posted by madrussian@Aug 30 2003, 16:52 * *One of the reasons why IT workers or engineers are slow to unionize is because they compete with one another for salaries/bonuses and because there is no clear line dividing "workforce" from the employers (at least in small-to-medium size companies). Your manager, manger's manager etc. all the way up to the CEO are often working stiffs just like you. There is a wide range of compensation for the people on the same hiearchical level too, would you talk to a "loser" about unionizing while being taken care of?
Only in the conditions of flat wages and monotonous work, where the most commoditized IT work is heading for anyway, organization of the proletariat is possible. **
You're quite right of course here. Unionizing for white collar jobs is much different than unionizing for blue collar jobs. (Although some sources actually are starting to describe a lot of tech-industry work as turning into "beige collar" work).
Fundamentally pure unions, are, as described by Ulanov/Lenin, "the most elementary type of class organizations". Union organization functioned best in the old industrial model, where you had large numbers of people doing essentially identical tasks, at least in terms of their heirarchial rank, separated rigidly from a "managerial class" including all positions above it on the hierarchy.
Where you lack these features, to the degree you do, organization becomes more difficult, as the strong communitarian impetus compelled forcibly by a rigid uniformity in hierchial position, conditions, aspirations, and common threats is replaced by the reality of within group competition to some extent. That doesn't mean organization/cooperation cannot still take place, but it tends to be of a different nature - strong to the degree a sense of strong communitarian identity still exists. An example might be the trade asociations that exist for doctors and lawyers. The medical doctors trade organization, the A.M.A., is quite effective. Most other trade/professional organizations however generally aren't, operating only where a strong sense of political knowedge identity transcends their cutthroat differences (i.e., lawyers).
Besides being competitive, technical professionals lack the strong sense of political education/identification developed by lawyers and some other groups (such as teachers) in the course of their liberal arts/professional training, so even that unifying ingedeient is lacking. The bottom line is that techies aren't organized or politically competent, in fact are on the bottom rung in terms of such organization and political competency, (i.e. social comtency)and as is almost always the case with such social incompetency/inferiority, it is quickly translated into economic incompetency/inferiority, in spite of the supposed technical ability these techies deperately cling to.
2003-08-30 21:16 | User Profile
Is there a forum where these struggling grads go online? I'm looking for a way to turn more people on to the OD forum. Young men who are experiencing first hand the effects of their own planned dispossession will be receptive to what is discussed here, in my opinion.
Send them one of these links:
Father's Job Going Overseas... [url=http://www.stormfront.org/forum/showthread.php?t=85270]http://www.stormfront.org/forum/showthread.php?t=85270[/url]
Illegal workers linked to low wages! [url=http://www.stormfront.org/forum/showthread.php?t=84007]http://www.stormfront.org/forum/showthread.php?t=84007[/url]
"Outsourcing" jobs to India - can anything be done? [url=http://www.stormfront.org/forum/showthread.php?t=70966]http://www.stormfront.org/forum/showthread.php?t=70966[/url]
Putting Whitey out of work : HIB and L1 Visas for Foreigners [url=http://www.stormfront.org/forum/showthread.php?t=56982]http://www.stormfront.org/forum/showthread.php?t=56982[/url]
2003-09-01 19:08 | User Profile
*Originally posted by Okiereddust@Aug 30 2003, 11:47 * ** That doesn't mean organization/cooperation cannot still take place, but it tends to be of a different nature - strong to the degree a sense of strong communitarian identity still exists. An example might be the trade asociations that exist for doctors and lawyers. The medical doctors trade organization, the A.M.A., is quite effective. Most other trade/professional organizations however generally aren't, operating only where a strong sense of political knowedge identity transcends their cutthroat differences (i.e., lawyers).
Besides being competitive, technical professionals lack the strong sense of political education/identification developed by lawyers and some other groups (such as teachers) in the course of their liberal arts/professional training, so even that unifying ingedeient is lacking. The bottom line is that techies aren't organized or politically competent, in fact are on the bottom rung in terms of such organization and political competency, (i.e. social comtency)and as is almost always the case with such social incompetency/inferiority, it is quickly translated into economic incompetency/inferiority, in spite of the supposed technical ability these techies deperately cling to. **
There are professional engineer organizations that did voice their concern with respect to H-1B program and globalization. IEEE is one of them.
Your example of teachers isn't very good one, because teachers are more like proletariat, doing essentially monotonous work.
As for doctors, or otherwise medical professionals like nurses, there are foreigners getting licenses there too. There is an H-1B program for the nurses, I think. And if you open yellow pages for any California location, there are plenty of MDs with foreign names.
2003-09-02 19:25 | User Profile
Rban,
Maybe he doesn't care to answer you, but I will.
That's an excellent idea you have for Jay. He can move there, deal with "affirmative action," live in third world sqauler, and make next to nothing. Only a Jew or wannabe plutocrat would suggest something like that.
Hello, Jay. :D
2003-09-02 21:26 | User Profile
Someone told me 1 million legal immigrants (mostly 3rd world invaders)and 1.5 million illegal immigrants (all 3rd world invaders) come to the US each year. Are these numbers real? That's a lot of people to absorb. Also heard many open subsidized businesses that are tax-exempt for 3 years. At which they "sell" the buiness to a cousin or family contact. The only change is in technical ownership.
2003-09-02 22:08 | User Profile
Think what an arrogant prick you would be **if you graduated and snapped up a 120k job right off the bat. This circumstance is great for you in the long run...it will give you a more well-balanced personality and teach you what is really important in life.
Who knows, one day you may end up serving me coffee at Starbucks.....**
RBAN,
Would that be as opposed to what an arrogant prick you ARE????
A little humility might not be such a bad trait for some arrogant third world Hindus to develop, at least until they develop to the level of "human being".
2003-09-03 02:04 | User Profile
Originally posted by madrussian+Sep 1 2003, 19:08 -->
QUOTE* (madrussian @ Sep 1 2003, 19:08 ) <!--QuoteBegin-Okiereddust@Aug 30 2003, 11:47 * ** That doesn't mean organization/cooperation cannot still take place, but it tends to be of a different nature - strong to the degree a sense of strong communitarian identity still exists. An example might be the trade asociations that exist for doctors and lawyers. The medical doctors trade organization, the A.M.A., is quite effective.ÃÂ Most other trade/professional organizations however generally aren't, operating only where a strong sense of political knowedge identity transcends their cutthroat differences (i.e., lawyers). Besides being competitive, technical professionals lack the strong sense of political education/identification developed by lawyers and some other groups (such as teachers) in the course of their liberal arts/professional training, so even that unifying ingedeient is lacking.ÃÂ **
There are professional engineer organizations that did voice their concern with respect to H-1B program and globalization. IEEE is one of them. ** **One ** professional organization, and its opposition by a lot of accounts was rather tepid.
Your example of teachers isn't very good one, because teachers are more like proletariat, doing essentially monotonous work. Believe it or not, at one time the occupation of teacher was rather esteemed. I agree though teachers are a rather special case. They do have a lot of special characterestics that seem to make them a very strong, unionized, political, and left-wing force in almost every country.
As for doctors, or otherwise medical professionals like nurses, there are foreigners getting licenses there too. There is an H-1B program for the nurses, I think. And if you open yellow pages for any California location, there are plenty of MDs with foreign names.
There is no special H1-B program that I know for nurses, but the regular one I think does pretty well for them. Organizationally Nurses seem completely different than doctors - they have nothing at all like the A.M.A.
It is true there are an awful lot of foreign doctors. They were brought in under special residency programs until a few years ago. Now get this the A.M.A. did a study decided there were enough home-grown lawyers here already, and almost COMPLETELY AXED these foreign residency programs a few years ago.
Can you imagine anything like that ever happening for computer professionals? :lol: