← Autodidact Archive · Original Dissent · jeffersonian
Thread ID: 8814 | Posts: 6 | Started: 2003-08-06
2003-08-06 18:48 | User Profile
Original Article may be Viewed At: [url=http://yumasun.com/artman/publish/articles/story_6607.shtml]Yuma Sun[/url]
**Immigrants held at gunpoint
BY LOUIE VILLALOBOS AND LOREN LISTIAK, Staff Writers Aug 6, 2003
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Three men unlawfully held six illegal immigrants at gunpoint early on the morning of July 31 in Gadsden until U.S. Border Patrol agents arrived, the Yuma County Sheriff's Office said.
Both the incident and the failure of the sheriff's office to release the information to the public sooner than Tuesday has officials and residents in Gadsden and Somerton upset.
Deputies arrested Matthew Paul Hoffman, 23, 909 Pagent Ave., Monday on suspicion of holding illegal aliens at gunpoint July 31.
Hoffman was booked into the Yuma County jail on suspicion of six counts of aggravated assault with a deadly weapon and five of unlawful imprisonment. Somerton Justice of the Peace Manny Figueroa set bond at $68,000 Tuesday afternoon.
Hoffman and two others detained six illegal immigrants ââ¬â two women, a 16-year-old boy and three children ages 6, 8 and 10 ââ¬â near the Colorado River and County 18 Street, according to deputies.
Sheriff's Lt. Eben Bratcher said Alexander Dumas, a second suspect, has been reached by detectives in his California home and will be allowed to voluntarily return to Yuma County to be questioned by deputies. It hasn't been determined if charges will be filed against him, but Bratcher said a warrant could be issued for his arrest if he doesn't return. The third suspect isn't expected to be charged, according to court records.
Officials said they consider this to be an isolated incident.
William Robbins, a Yuma Border Patrol spokesman, said the six immigrants crossed illegally at about 1 a.m. July 31 and were confronted by the three men armed with guns, flashlights and handcuffs.
Robbins said a Border Patrol camera operator working the area saw the group gather near County 18th Street but didn't realize the illegal immigrants were being held at gunpoint. Robbins said a patrol helicopter was sent to the area and called for agents when the pilot realized something wasn't right.
Though five of the illegal immigrants were handcuffed, no one was injured and agents contacted deputies. Deputies took down the names of three armed men and released them pending an investigation, which later led to Hoffman's arrest.
According to court documents, Hoffman said he went to the river on the morning of July 31 with the purpose of apprehending illegal immigrants because he was tired of them coming into the United States and nobody doing anything to stop them.
As the sheriff's office continues to investigate the case, Somerton Mayor Agustin Tumbaga said he wonders why deputies didn't tell Somerton police officers about the incident or warn residents that armed citizens were patrolling the area.
"They're not informing the community about what's going on," said Tumbaga, after calling Somerton Police Chief Terry Hollis to inform him of the incident. "Especially if you got people out doing what they're doing."
Sharing Tumbaga's concern is Nena Garcia, a Gadsden resident who sits on the Gadsden Community Development Board.
She said hearing about the July 31 incident four days after it happened upset her, especially because deputies didn't mention it when they met with Gadsden residents two days later in a town hall meeting to discuss south county law enforcement issues. During that meeting on Saturday, residents expressed their concern over what they called a large number of illegal immigrants that cross through Gadsden from Mexico.
"I think they should let us know what's going on in our community," Garcia said.
Bratcher said though all three men were identified by deputies at the scene, it took investigators several days to interview the six illegal immigrants.
He said the department didn't release the information earlier because it didn't want the men to know the investigation was being conducted.
"This was a complicated case," Bratcher said. "We just needed to make sure we had everything covered." **
Typical Crap Reporting. Firstly these "immigrants" were criminals illegally entering a soveriegn nation. Secondly I don't see the crime. US citizens are empowered to make a citizens arrest if they see a crime being committed. Of course no mention of this. The media will quietly ignore all issues but the evil white men denying the poor immigrant the right to steal jobs, medical care, and social services from Americans.
2003-08-06 20:34 | User Profile
What is really concerning is the issue of the Border Patrol Agents contacting Deputies for the possible incarceration of U.S. citizens.
Those men that detained the criminals should be commended, not persecuted.
I have seen the Border Patrol duty roster from our southern border and the last names of the individuals are mainly Mexican. ( Torres, Sanchez, Rodriguez,Guiz,...etc..etc ) It should be no suprise that Mexicans (?) hired by the Border Patrol will discriminate against Legal, U.S. residents and will contribute to the undermining of our national sovereignty.
Affimative Action Indeed.
Lets "Progress", backwards...... :huh:
2003-08-06 22:02 | User Profile
Sally Suburbia: "It's good that those evil White guys were arrested! They violated the rights of those sweet, innocent undocumented entrants!"
Patty PTAMeeting: "Right! In fact, I just saw a documentary on PBS, hosted by James Goldbergsteinwitz; he interviewed an immigration expert, Bob Feldnikbaumrosen, who explained that all humans are Global Citizens [tm] and should be able to come and go as they please, into whichever country they want!"
Amerikwa 2003 -- brought to you by...uhhhhmmm...Protestants! :)
2003-08-09 00:47 | User Profile
golfball,
Sadly the so-called "Border Patrol" is over 50% Mexican these days. Talk about the Fox watching the Hen-House.
Patriots Arrested For Holding Illegals Until Border Patrol Arrived [url=http://forum.originaldissent.com/index.php?showtopic=10126]http://forum.originaldissent.com/index.php...showtopic=10126[/url]
Yes! Very True!
** What is really concerning is the issue of the Border Patrol Agents contacting Deputies for the possible incarceration of U.S. citizens. Those men that detained the criminals should be commended, not persecuted.-golfball **
Yes!
**...these "immigrants" were criminals illegally entering a soveriegn nation. Secondly I don't see the crime. US citizens are empowered to make a citizens arrest if they see a crime being committed.-jeffersonian **
2003-08-09 04:56 | User Profile
I checked out some the [url=http://www.freerepublic.com/focus/f-news/960242/posts]responses[/url] in freeperland to this article. The open borders, Illegal-lovin' freepers are out in full force there: Cultural Jerkoff, PR(ick)ND21, Poopbah, CWOJackass, and Chancellor Asinine.
[SIZE=2]I could almost feel my blood pressure start to rise as I read their idiotic posts.[/SIZE]
2003-08-09 08:57 | User Profile
Kurt,
For the most part I greatly enjoyed the replies of the Freepers, this show how far out the neocons are from the avage GOPer.
**To: AZ GRAMMY
Who will get out first. Illegal immigrants or the Americans detaining them.
2 posted on 08/07/2003 8:32 PM PDT by Bogey78O (The Clinton's have pardoned more terrorists than they ever captured/killed -Peach)
To: AZ GRAMMY
This nation won't last much longer. Just enjoy the ride-I give the implosion a 20 year countdown.
3 posted on 08/07/2003 8:32 PM PDT by Destro
**Comment #4 Removed by Moderator
Comment #5 Removed by Moderator
Comment #7 Removed by Moderator**
To: AZ GRAMMY
They did not physically assault the illegals, so what's the problem? They should be commended.
11 posted on 08/07/2003 8:45 PM PDT by Bigg Red
Comment #12 Removed by Moderator
To: Chad Fairbanks
"This is a very disturbing thing to happen here," Oliva said. "We can't have people with guns do the job of law enforcement agencies."
Bwahahaha. Then who should do the job? Despite the pro ILLEGAL immigrant sympathies of even Republicans like Bush or Hannity, it is out of control here in the southwest.
14 posted on 08/07/2003 8:47 PM PDT by FastCoyote
To: Cultural Jihad
"Shoving a gun in the faces of women and children is not an assault?"
They are federal criminals. If they didn't want a gun pointed at them they should have stayed in Mexico.
15 posted on 08/07/2003 8:48 PM PDT by Centurion2000
To: Cultural Jihad
"Not very responsible talk."
What I find irresponsible is millions of their people defecating on our laws, spitting on our sovereignty, killing our law enforcement officers and our citizens, trashing our country, choking off our social services, hospitals, schools, taking jobs, etc. etc. etc. etc.
18 posted on 08/07/2003 8:50 PM PDT by Joe Hadenuf
To: AZ GRAMMY
Asking a group to stay put while making a phone call is permitted and would constitute a citizen's arrest, he said.
Oh yeah, that'll work. Sure. Thanks for the advice. What is the spanish word for "stay put"? I'm sure the "group" will wait patiently for law enforcement to arrive while you stand by them unarmed. Any beverage suggestions while we all wait?
19 posted on 08/07/2003 8:50 PM PDT by montag813
To: 782gear
"We can't have people with guns do the job of law enforcement agencies."
yes we can
23 posted on 08/07/2003 8:53 PM PDT by conservativefromGa
To: Centurion2000
" They are federal criminals. If they didn't want a gun pointed at them they should have stayed in Mexico. "
Roger that. I am fresh out of sympathy.
25 posted on 08/07/2003 8:54 PM PDT by moehoward
To: Joe Hadenuf
dont forget thier armed soldiers crossing our borders and firing upon our border patrol agents.
26 posted on 08/07/2003 8:54 PM PDT by Dr. Marten
To: Cultural Jihad
Tell President Bush to get off his butt and protect our borders and sovereignty. Remind him they are Federal borders.
28 posted on 08/07/2003 8:56 PM PDT by Joe Hadenuf
To: Dr. Marten
Yeah, and the thousands of drunk illegal aliens slaughtering American citizens on our roads, rapes, robberies, murders and other general chaos they create.
32 posted on 08/07/2003 8:58 PM PDT by Joe Hadenuf
To: Cultural Jihad
Tell President Bush to get off his butt and protect our borders and sovereignty. Remind him they are Federal borders.
33 posted on 08/07/2003 8:58 PM PDT by Joe Hadenuf
To: AZ GRAMMY
Hugo Oliva, Mexican consul in Yuma: "We can't have..."
34 posted on 08/07/2003 8:59 PM PDT by seamole
To: Cultural Jihad
"Vigilantism erodes justice."
Justice is dead in this country.
36 posted on 08/07/2003 8:59 PM PDT by Centurion2000
To: Cultural Jihad
Tell President Bush to get off his butt and protect our borders and sovereignty. Remind him they are Federal borders.
39 posted on 08/07/2003 9:04 PM PDT by Joe Hadenuf
To: Centurion2000
You are right. You or I would get in more trouble taking a stroll in some gated communites than a citizen of another country jumping our border.
40 posted on 08/07/2003 9:04 PM PDT by KEVLAR
To: Joe Hadenuf
Tell President Bush to get off his butt and protect our borders and sovereignty.
The U.N said No
43 posted on 08/07/2003 9:09 PM PDT by comnet
To: Cultural Jihad
"Vigilantism erodes justice."
What would you propose instead of citizens' arrest in this situation? You're quick to criticize but you're not offering any suggestions as to how we can solve this problem. Or do you think we should have open borders? I see the border militias as a form of civil disobedience. It comes with a price, but the accused are putting their freedom and safety on the line to get our attention. They are already starting to pay for it. But they are acting in the common interest and apparently with deeply held convictions. How can we obviate the need for their protest?
47 posted on 08/07/2003 9:13 PM PDT by risk
To: Joe Hadenuf; Tancredo Fan; All
Your perserverance has paid off.
Lars Larson, Hannity, Scarborough and Savage are now covering the illegals.
Now we have a scarey situation in Cali.
If Davis resigns to stop the recall we will have Bustamante to finish turning the state into Mexifornia.
Is Bustamante a La Raza supporter. I know he is a LULAC supporter. Which is almost as bad. One of their goals is that illegal hispanics should be allowed to work airport security. Youch.
48 posted on 08/07/2003 9:13 PM PDT by oceanperch
To: strela
So doing the right thing, and not harming, or raping, or beating, or murdering possible terrorists who have no legal right to be country, but only detaining the invaders is considered "taking the law into your own hands" in your little black book. As if the border is patroled, or guarded, or secure. So when a burgler comes into your house steal all you have worked for you will wait to consult with your attorney to see if it is OK to try and stop them. And where are the ILLEGAL ALIENS going. To take some snap shots of the Grand Canyon? No! They are headed to the nearest welfare office to get free medical, food stamps,and money to send back to their beloved Mejico. So it is true that the WHITE GUYS, who probably served in the US miltary, are tired of invaders stealing the wealth of the nation, broke the law. And I am sure the Latino judge and Latino jury in Yuma will look past the fact that they are WHITE GUYS and find them innocent of all charges while the illegals are having a barbeque at the sheriffs house.
454 posted on 08/08/2003 11:13 PM PDT by novacation
To: risk; novacation; Joe Hadenuf; m18436572
Your chain is being yanked. We all have an entertaining round of name calling and while this thread has been alive another 8,000 illegal immigrants have crossed the border, if you assume a round figure of approximately 2 million annually.
What are we going to do about it, other than vent on FR. It's not a Republican site by the way. When it was founded, JR was a conservative democrat. Not anymore, Klintoon took care of that.
Many of us have made assumptions that the story that inspired this thread does not necessarily support. We don't know how far from the border "Dumb" and "Dumber" were when they detained the illegals. We don't know if they witnessed firsthand said illegals crossing the border. We don't know if they requested said illegals to stop and sit awhile to wait for La Migra to pick them up before they cuffed them and held them at gunpoint. Many of us on both sides don't communicate our opinions clearly enough, myself included, especially since it's a very emotionally loaded issue.
I don't want to be stopped and detained by some bozo just because he doesn't like the way I look, and I don't think anyone else would either. That's my biggest complaint with the 'Homeland Security' BS. It harrasses US citizens without solving the problem of foreigners being here that want to do us harm. "Dumb" and "Dumber" have their hearts in the right place, they just didn't go about a solution very intelligently. The Border Patrol and the INS are doing a miserable job, and if they don't improve something has to be done. That something has to be well thought out and planned, with legal contingencies to back it up. If someone sees illegals cross the border firsthand, they can and should effect a citizens arrest, detain them, and hand them over to be deported.
This is a huge problem, with many examples. We need to channel our venting into constructive actions that improve the situation. I'm open to suggestions.
456 posted on 08/08/2003 11:42 PM PDT by eldoradude (Save endangered feces - ban Ex-lax!)
To: eldoradude
California is in the dumps because of the liberals and illegals. When California falls the rest of the nation will follow. The future is very dark. As much as the rest of the nation may joke, the current crisis in California will effect the nation and the world. .Period.
457 posted on 08/09/2003 12:07 AM PDT by novacation
To: AZ GRAMMY
Of course, illegal aliens should all be rounded up and expelled immediately. There should be an emergency crash course program, all law enforcement, volunteers should get together and go block by block and track down any illegal alien because they are invading our country. They have no right to be here. There are many millions of illegal aliens here. All should be thrown out immediately in the worst way possible, not treated well. They should be thrown out brutally so they know never to come back. Soldiers should be put on the border with shoot to kill orders. Anybody coming across the border is invading this country. America has the right to defend herself. Someone comes into your country, you have a right to shoot them in self defense. You won't have to have signs in spanish warning them. Believe me, after the first five or six are killed, they will get the message, very, very quickly. You won't have to translate it.
462 posted on 08/09/2003 12:38 AM PDT by majordivit
**