← Autodidact Archive · Original Dissent · w.bales
Thread ID: 5064 | Posts: 13 | Started: 2003-02-17
2003-02-17 15:21 | User Profile
[url=http://dailynews.att.net/cgi-bin/news?e=pri&dt=030217&cat=news&st=newsiraqturkeydelaydc]http://dailynews.att.net/cgi-bin/news?e=pr...aqturkeydelaydc[/url]
Turk Minister Says No U.S. Troops Without Aid Deal Updated 9:45 AM ET February 17, 2003
ISTANBUL (Reuters) - Turkish Foreign Minister Yasar Yakis said on Monday Turkey would not open its territory to U.S. troops ahead of a possible war in Iraq without an agreement on financial aid to help cover the cost of the conflict.
The United States wants urgent Turkish approval of plans to set up a 'northern front' against Baghdad from Turkey's southern border, but Ankara has dragged its feet fearing it may not be adequately recompensed for its support.
"The question of whether or not we send the proposal (to parliament) will come onto the agenda only after an agreement. I can't give a time because first we have to reach an agreement," Yakis told the state-run Anatolian news agency.
Yakis met President Bush last week in Washington, where the president laid out the package the United States was offering.
Parliament speaker Bulent Arinc said earlier on Monday the government would not present a proposal allowing U.S. troops to parliament on Tuesday, when the United States had hoped it would be given a 'green light' to forge ahead with its pre-war plans.
2003-02-17 15:29 | User Profile
...on financial aid to help cover the cost of the conflict... plus few more billions for good measure, wink, wink, nod, nod...
Good thing the United States isn't in debt or anything.
HEY!! Maybe we all could help out by making advance payments on our taxes. Where's my checkbook?
Perhaps I should re-register at FreeRepublic and start a thread requesting donations and advance payments on federal taxes to the "Support Bush's Coup in Iraq Fund". There's a winner!
2003-02-19 09:42 | User Profile
The price tag is $26 billion. That's "billion" with a "b." And the Turks claim it's still not enough.
You can read about it [url=http://www.timesonline.co.uk/article/0,,3-583040,00.html]here[/url] .
Walter
2003-02-20 12:38 | User Profile
no crap!!!
I posted this story about 4 days ago AND THIS MORNING CNN IS REPORTING its up to 30, that's THIRTY!!!!! BILLION!!!!
They must be laughing thier asses off!!
And I repeat, remember just two weeks ago when the ZOG was pissed at France and Germany for not joining in the "PROTECTION" of Turkey.
THIS IS OUTRAGEOUS!!
Are Americans this completely STUPID???
2003-02-20 13:03 | User Profile
It may seem that I love to bash the FraudRepublic and that would be true (its just so easy!!)
Here is this thread where Freepers are NOW trashing Turkey:
Turkey Raises Stakes in U.S. Row Over Aid, Troops
[url=http://www.freerepublic.com/focus/news/847523/posts]http://www.freerepublic.com/focus/news/847523/posts[/url]
And here it but one thread (OUT OF MANY, MANY FRANCE BASHING THREADS ON FR) where the freakers are bashing France over the alleged failure to ââ¬Åprotectââ¬Â Turkey:
Chirac Says France Would Protect Turkey in War (France is playing games again)
[url=http://www.freerepublic.com/focus/news/841909/posts]http://www.freerepublic.com/focus/news/841909/posts[/url]
On FraudRepublic, the hypocrisy and stupidity has no bounds.
2003-02-20 22:07 | User Profile
**Are Americans this completely STUPID??? **
Yes. Dumb and getting dumbdowned dumber daily. There really is a sucker born every millisecond.
2003-03-01 12:28 | User Profile
W. Bales,
It gets worse. Check out this mess. More people that will have to be paid off.
As for your post, just who in the hell do the Turks think they are to pull this stunt with the "world`s only superpower?"
ÃÂ Kurds Say They Will Resist Turkish Troops That Join Any U.S. Invasion of Northern Iraq
The Associated Press SALAHUDDIN, Iraq Feb. 28 ââ¬â Kurdish leaders said Friday they will resist if the United States lets Turks join an invasion of northern Iraq, raising fears American troops will be caught in a generations-old ethnic struggle for control of the strategic border region.
Turkey plans to send thousands of troops into northern Iraq during any U.S. invasion, ostensibly to provide humanitarian aid for people displaced by the fighting. It also wants to prevent weapons held by Kurdish groups from falling into the hands of independence-minded Turkish Kurds, who also have bases in northern Iraq.
"Our people are going to resist the plan with all the means at their disposal," said Kurdish Deputy Prime Minister Sami Abdul Rahman. "Nothing whatsoever will persuade us to accept an incursion of Turkish forces."
"The answer of our people is a flat no," he told reporters after closed-door sessions of a conference of 50 members of an Iraqi opposition steering committee formed in December to guide plans for the country if Saddam Hussein is toppled.
The Kurds fear the Turks will remain indefinitely in northern Iraq and try to subjugate Kurdish aspirations of self-rule because Ankara fears that could encourage Turkey's own sizable Kurdish minority's demands for the same rights.
Turkish troops will be "a boot on our chest" meant to "strangle our people," Rahman said.
"The freedom of our people is part of the price paid to Turkey" for its cooperation in the U.S. military plan, he said at the mountain stronghold of the Kurdistan Democratic Party. Kurds in the bazaars, streets and even the floor of the Kurdish parliament have said they would be willing to take up arms against any Turkish forces who enter the autonomous enclave. That could drag U.S. troops into an ethnic war as they are trying to restore order in a post-Saddam Iraq.
If such a situation arises, Kurdish officials and Iraqi opposition figures privately have suggested they would launch a propaganda battle against a U.S.-led war, casting America as an enemy of the Iraqi people's aspirations for freedom.
Rahman's Kurdistan Democratic Party governs the western half of the autonomous Kurdish region in northern Iraq, a relatively democratic enclave created by their oppressed minority after the 1991 Gulf War and protected from Saddam's forces by U.S. and British air patrols. The eastern part is controlled by the Patriotic Union of Kurdistan.
The Kurds generally have been pro-American. But their concerns about a possible Turkish incursion are growing.
In exchange for their cooperation in a possible U.S. northern front against Saddam, Turks have asked Washington for money and guarantees that Iraqi Kurds living within a de facto Kurdish-run government won't use the war as an opportunity to declare an independent state.
One of the two top Kurdish leaders, Jalal Talabani, sought to assure Turkey on Thursday that the Kurds will not declare an independent state.
The Kurds also are enraged at reports Turkey wants the Kurds' battle-hardened militiamen, the Peshmergas, to be disarmed. Kurdish officials and Iraqi opposition leaders have hinted they would seek help from Iran, a U.S. enemy that hosts thousands of exiled Iraqi Shiite warriors the "Badr Brigades" of the Supreme Council for the Islamic Revolution in Iraq on Iraq's eastern border.
Hamid al-Bayati a senior member of the Supreme Council, was asked whether Iran would intervene if Turkey sends in troops.
"They have an option to allow the Badr brigade to enter" Iraq, he replied.
A U.S. delegation to the talks is headed by Zalmay Khalilzad, the White House liaison to the Iraqi opposition. At the opening of the gathering on Wednesday, Khalilzad tried to allay the opposition's fears of a planned U.S.-military government. He assured them the martial rule would be a transition to full democracy and would be kept as brief as possible.
Khalilzad also announced a proposal to break up the Iraqi opposition groups into five task forces to deal with a range of government issues.
On Thursday, al-Bayati said the conference had appointed a six-member executive to serve as an "interim leadership" in a post-Saddam Iraq. The opposition figures also have organized 14 subcommittees to address details of post-Saddam governance.
Two of those designated for the leadership committee did not attend Adnan Pachachi, a secular Sunni and former foreign minister, and Ayad Allawi, head of Iraqi National Accord, which has links to the U.S. establishment.
Pachachi released a statement denying knowledge of the committee and said he would not take part.
Copyright 2003 The Associated Press. All rights reserved. This material may not be published, broadcast, rewritten, or redistributed. Copyright é 2002 ABC News Internet Ventures.
All this "Democracy" and "nation building" can get right expensive!
2003-03-02 14:51 | User Profile
Yes -- the Kurdish aspect. Increasingly surreal. But Sharon shall order Bush to throw a big, bad check thier way AND up the ante for Turkey, too!
I am becoming increasingly irritated while watching/perusing the federal media (including now, FR), Sertorius. It is IMPOSSIBLE for an American to support this war. The federal media talking heads spout absolute non-sense while attempting to appear completely lucid and rational.
[Reminds me of: "Don't piss on my shoes and tell me its raining"]
BTW, if you have not seen it -- run, don't walk, to the local Blockbuster and rent "We Were Soldiers" starring Mel Gibson. I only just saw that last weekend--it's now in my top ten of ever. What a great movie. War should an absolutle LAST resort AS A MEANS OF CLEAR SELF DEFENSE OR where a conflict clearly is going global. Border clashes; internal squabbles; civil wars; regime changes just to make someone feel better for whatever reason DO NOT CUT IT. But, once the decision to go to war is made and under justifiable and clear circumstances the whole of the America PEOPLE support same, we should let lose the military with ALL of its fury, no holds barred so to speak--get the politicians out of the war. (Later, perhaps this PM, I have a related debate question on military strategy which I would like to engage you in-- remember these names: McArthur; Westmoreland; Patton; Singlaub).
There are two items of particular interest which are in the special scenes part of the DVD:
1) the real (then Lt. Col now Lt. Gen-ret.) Harold Moore was interviewed and siad the message of this movie is and should be: "Hate the War -- Love the Warrior."
2) A scene which was cut from the final edit where Moore (Gibson) was post battle debriefed in Saigon by Westmoreland and the master war criminal and murderous idiot McNamara where Moore says (paraprashing): "You can't expect US to drive the little bastards home, gentlemen, they ARE home." Think about it. The director said he cut the scene so that politics would not detract from the movie's pro-warrior message.
Also, I would be interested in knowing if you (as did I) felt the need to replay three or four times any scene in which Sam Elliot (the old gruff CSM)appears!!??
2003-03-02 15:51 | User Profile
Every vote (other than maybe Britain) that the US gets in the UN for war with Iraq will have been won by bribes and threats (many voters are 3rd-world nations, they should be cheap to buy). Bush, always the liar, calls the countries that support him the "coalition of the willing." It's really the coalition of the bribed and coerced. Too bad for the US that $15 billion didn't buy Turkey's support.
2003-03-02 16:03 | User Profile
Y`all,
I have a fair question. Bush has been throwing money around like it`s friday and he is in a strip bar getting one table dance after another.
I`d like to know where he gets the constitutional authority to write blank checks like that without congressional approval.
I guess the Neo-con answer would be the joint resolution allows him to do this without any approval. I know they say that when it comes to a declaration of war that the only thing Congress can do is to decide to cut off the money, otherwise, cut the check.
2003-03-02 16:08 | User Profile
W. Bales,
I look forward to your questions and comments later.
2003-03-02 17:58 | User Profile
What we have in America is nothing but a criminally elected regime.
Democracy is a sham in the United States and the only right we have is to vote for one of two pre-selected, kosher aproved zionist lackeys to be our President for four to eight years. The present Oval office holder did not even win the election but through creative voting engineering.
This unelected President has been spending money like a drunken sailor on shore leave in Hong Hong and by the time he is sent packing to his ranch, we will be another 2 Trillion Bucks in debt along with being the most despised country on earth.
2003-03-03 02:31 | User Profile
Tonight our CIA 'bagmen' are convincing the Turkish politicians that democracy is better with a few million stuffed into their pockets and turn the next vote around to appease the war mongers.