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Thread ID: 4858 | Posts: 7 | Started: 2003-02-08
2003-02-08 03:33 | User Profile
[url=http://seattlepi.nwsource.com/national/107592_prezpoll07.shtml]Modern presidents favored over Founding Fathers[/url] Friday, February 7, 2003
By THOMAS HARGROVE AND GUIDO H. STEMPEL III SCRIPPS HOWARD NEWS SERVICE
Modern-era presidents such as John F. Kennedy, Ronald Reagan and Bill Clinton have eclipsed most of the denizens of Mount Rushmore in the hearts and minds of the U.S. people.
Such traditional Founding Fathers as George Washington, John Adams and Thomas Jefferson are rarely cited as favorite chief executives, according to a survey of 1,039 adult residents of the United States conducted by Scripps Howard News Service and Ohio University.
"We are losing our history, or at least an understanding of our history, by much of the American population," concluded James Thurber, director of the Center for Congressional and Presidential Studies at American University.
"I see this in the classroom all the time. Students are influenced according to who was president when they were growing up. They don't know who the Founding Fathers were, except intellectually. Many Americans just don't understand much about their presidents, mostly because of apathy," Thurber said.
Participants in the survey were asked: "Who would you say is your favorite American president, either living or dead?"
The only president portrayed on the national monument at Mount Rushmore, S.D., who did well in the survey was Abraham Lincoln, topping the list with 16 percent.
Kennedy came in a strong second with 14 percent, followed by Clinton at 13, Reagan at 10, Franklin Roosevelt at 7 percent and current President Bush at 6 percent.
George Washington -- first president of the United States, commander in chief of American forces during the Revolutionary War and the presiding officer at the Constitutional Convention in Philadelphia in 1787 -- came in seventh place with only 5 percent.
"The contribution that a president makes is quite a different question from that of their popularity," Thurber said. "Kennedy really didn't contribute anything. But as soon as he was assassinated, he became a myth."
The popularity of presidents varied considerably according to education. Lincoln was twice as popular among college graduates than he is among people who did not finish high school. Kennedy and Clinton, meanwhile, were twice as popular among high school graduates than among college graduates.
There are also considerable gender gaps, with the clear majority of Reagan supporters being male and most of Kennedy's supporters being female.
Nearly half of Clinton's supporters are black while nearly all of Reagan's supporters are white. Even though he signed the Emancipation Proclamation abolishing slavery in the South, Abraham Lincoln was picked by only 8 percent of African Americans in the poll.
The poll was conducted at the Scripps Survey Research Center at Ohio University. Residents of the United States were interviewed by telephone Jan. 17-30 in a study funded by a grant from the Scripps Howard Foundation.
"I see this in the classroom all the time. Students are influenced according to who was president when they were growing up. They don't know who the Founding Fathers were, except intellectually. Many Americans just don't understand much about their presidents, mostly because of apathy," Thurber said.
Not just apathy. Keep following the chain of causes. Where does the apathy come from? I sumbit that it is inculcated by the politically correct culture that we are immersed in. THEY don't want the American people to be familiar with, or have a connection to, their history. Such a connection might endanger THEIR utopian designs, after all.
The only president portrayed on the national monument at Mount Rushmore, S.D., who did well in the survey was Abraham Lincoln, topping the list with 16 percent.
Not a surprise at all, since Lincoln is one of the saints canonized by the Establishment.
2003-02-08 05:20 | User Profile
PaleoconAvatar,
Very True. Not just apathy. Keep following the chain of causes. Where does the apathy come from? I sumbit that it is inculcated by the politically correct culture that we are immersed in. THEY don't want the American people to be familiar with, or have a connection to, their history. Such a connection might endanger THEIR utopian designs, after all.
None of the Founding Fathers were PC.
My votes for the Best American Presidents.
George Washington
Thomas Jefferson
Millard Fillmore
John Tyler
Franklin Pierce
Jefferson Davis
Andrew Johnson
Warren Harding
Calvin Coolidge
My votes for the Worst American Presidents.
Franklin Delano Roosevelt
Harry S. Truman
John Fitzgerald Kennedy
Lyndon Baines Johnson
Richard M. Nixon
William Jefferson Clinton
Link:
Yes I know it's from PBS, but it has some good information.
THE AMERICAN PRESIDENT [url=http://www.pbs.org/wnet/amerpres/]http://www.pbs.org/wnet/amerpres/[/url]
Related thread:
Who was the greatest American president? [url=http://forum.originaldissent.com/index.php?act=ST&f=11&t=3573&hl=presidents]http://forum.originaldissent.com/index.php...3&hl=presidents[/url]
2003-02-09 18:45 | User Profile
Lincoln was twice as popular among college graduates than he is among people who did not finish high school.
Proof that 'education' works. And proof of just what it is that education is trying to accomplish. Given the liberal political inclinations of most college graduates we can only assume that they know nothing about Lincoln. If they did they would have to despise him.
2003-02-11 00:50 | User Profile
Nicholas Strakon at [url=http://www.thornwalker.com/ditch/lights94.htm]The Last Ditch[/url] gives his list of the worst presidents:
I agree with the last six choices. But if Polk and Jefferson are damned, then it seems the republic was doomed almost at the outset. Then again, Strakon would probably agree.
2003-02-11 05:32 | User Profile
I'm curious why nobody seems to like Eisenhower. He presided over the 50s, one of America's best times, and is the only US president in history to stand up to Israel. I'm missing something.
-D
2003-02-11 06:17 | User Profile
I've always held the curious notion that the best possible Presidents are those commonly derided as caretaker presidents. Since noone would bother founding a damn nation if they expected it to be mired in constant warfare and catastrophe then it seems to me the Original Idea was that the ideal President be an efficient, colorless executive who sees his job as a job - keeping the roads navigable and the drinking water potable and putting out the cat at night- and not a store-bought Date With Destiny, with a honest-to-gosh Legacy up for grabs, if he can complicate something already simple & efficient or, failing that, get a lot of people killed.
2003-02-11 18:03 | User Profile
Of course, modern presidents are favored over Founding Fathers.
Reagan is the neocon god (at least it isn't any Bush) and Clinton is the leftist god. Not only are these presidents better known, but they better share the values of modern Americans than the Founding Fathers.
Of early presidents, only the big-government advocate Lincoln gets any praise in modern public schools. And, even this praise is deminishing as more people learn that Lincoln wasn't so anti-slave as traditionally believed.