← Autodidact Archive · Original Dissent · Pennsylvania_Dutch
Thread ID: 19311 | Posts: 18 | Started: 2005-07-28
2005-07-28 04:08 | User Profile
House passes CAFTA 217-215. :censored:
2005-07-28 05:06 | User Profile
True, but then again we are not allowed to have actual property and in order to live we are forced, as a consequence, to labor in return for little green meal tickets that represent our further indebtedness ("legal tender" is the orwellian phrase), so what does this mean beside nothing yesterday is still nothing tomorrow. It's not as if we can own stuff or anything. It does mean, of course, that persons who are easily decieved will not resent getting a smaller quota of food quite as much, because the fairness of this punishment by their keepers, namely their selfishness in wanting more than their fair share when salvadorans are going hungry, will doubtless distract and amuse them. But do people that dumb really deserve better?
2005-07-28 05:37 | User Profile
I think that this if OFF TOPIC, not sure, but I feel that it is very important....
In order to understand what they are saying and how it works you do have to be a little bit crazy like I am or it will make to sense to you.
It is like when Proffesor Hawking was talking about Black Holes I didn't know what the heck he was talking about but at the same time could I feel therefore I knew what he meant as to what he was talking about.
To me this article is incredible and is like looking behind the curtain, if it is true or not I have no idea but I copied the whole thing and will study it line by line.
Go to [B]JeffRense.com[/B] and look for [U]"Silent weapons for quiet wars"[/U]
Once again, you must feel what they are talking about instead of understanding what they are talking about.......good luck.
2005-07-28 11:16 | User Profile
[QUOTE=Pennsylvania_Dutch]House passes CAFTA 217-215. :censored:[/QUOTE] As soon as I heard that they were holding the vote in the dead of night, I figured the fix was in. This is not what the debt-ridden, non-competitive, lunch-being-eaten-by-the-Chinese, American economy needs at that moment.
2005-07-28 11:29 | User Profile
Since the Red River Valley region of Minnesota & North & South Dakota is the largest suger beet producing region in the nation, I thought It would be nice to see how the news media in that area is reporting on this treasonous act.
[url]http://www.in-forum.com/articles/index.cfm?id=98874§ion=news[/url]
Thursday, July 28, 2005
House passes CAFTA Forum and wire reports, The Forum Published Thursday, July 28, 2005 ÷ advertisement ÷ WASHINGTON - A bitterly fought trade accord with six Latin American nations won House passage by the narrowest of margins Thursday morning after Republicans held the vote open well past the usual 15 minutes to muster enough members of their party to ensure approval.
When time for the vote on the Central American Free Trade Agreement expired at 11:17 p.m. local time, the nays outnumbered the yeas by 180 to 175. But, a few minutes past midnight, the GOP leadership, ignoring Democratic protests that the rules were being violated, had rounded up enough votes to win by 217 to 215.
[B]The House vote was effectively the last hurdle - and by far the steepest - facing CAFTA, which will tear down barriers to trade and investment between the United States, Costa Rica, the Dominican Republic, El Salvador, Guatemala, Honduras and Nicaragua.[/B]
[B]Rep. Earl Pomeroy, D-N.D., said the Bush administration and Republican leaders strong-armed Republican House members into voting for CAFTA. He said they used highway funds and the threat of stripping chairmanships from Republican House members if they didn't support CAFTA.
"I've seen the Republican leadership break arms on close votes before, but nothing quite this ugly," Pomeroy said.[/B]
Although the deal was approved by the Senate last month, it was overwhelmingly opposed by House Democrats who contend that it is wrong to strike a free-trade pact with poor countries lacking strong protection for worker rights. During Wednesday night's debate, which lasted 2 1/2 hours, the intensity of their opposition shone through in emotional condemnations such as that by Rep. Dennis Kucinich, D-Ohio, who thundered: "CAFTA is for multinational companies who want to make a profit by shutting plants in the United States and moving to places with cheap labor."
To win, the White House and GOP congressional leaders had to overcome resistance from dozens of Republican members who were also concerned about the agreement because of issues ranging from the perceived threat to the U.S. sugar industry to more general worries about the impact of global trade on U.S. jobs.
Before the vote, GOP leaders, who had negotiated a number of deals in recent days to sway Republicans, made it clear they were prepared to twist arms and, if necessary, extend the voting period.
"It will be a tough vote, but we will pass CAFTA tonight," House Majority Leader Tom DeLay, R-Texas, told reporters Wednesday morning. "And we will do it with very few Democrats on board." Asked how long the vote would be kept open, DeLay replied, "When we get to 218," one vote in excess of a majority.
[B]Underscoring the importance President Bush attaches to the pact, he put his prestige on the line by making a rare appearance with Vice President Dick Cheney during the weekly closed-door meeting of the House Republican Conference. The president spoke for an hour, lawmakers said, stressing the national security implications of CAFTA, which are rooted in the concern that growing anti-American sentiment in Latin America may flourish if the United States refuses to open its markets wider to the nations that negotiated the pact.[/B]
[B]"Mothers and fathers in El Salvador love their children as much as we love our children here," Bush said, stressing the need to look out for the young democracies in "our neighborhood," according to lawmakers. He also noted that four of the six countries - the Dominican Republic, El Salvador, Honduras and Nicaragua - have assisted the U.S. military effort in Iraq.[/B]
[B]Rep. Collin Peterson, D-Minn., said earlier Wednesday that much like the North American Free Trade Agreement, CAFTA is being oversold to Americans. For the first time in 50 years, this year the United States will import more agricultural goods than it exports, Peterson said. He fears CAFTA will only add to the growing trade deficit.
"I'm all for trade, but we've got to be smart about this. We just keep giving everything away," said Peterson of Minnesota's 7th District, who represents the largest sugar- producing district in the nation.[/B]
[B]Approval of CAFTA handed a victory to Bush at a time when his clout on Capitol Hill has been called into question, and it also gave a badly needed boost to his broader free-trade agenda. The White House is hoping to hammer out a free-trade accord encompassing all the nations of the Western Hemisphere.
More important, it wants to successfully conclude the negotiations under way in the World Trade Organization to lower trade barriers on a global basis. A failure to push the much smaller CAFTA through Congress would have seriously dashed hopes for those deals[/B].
Those considerations turned CAFTA into a political battleground far out of proportion to its economic significance. Proponents touted the six countries involved as constituting the second largest market for U.S. goods in Latin America after Mexico, absorbing $15 billion in U.S. exports last year. But that is just a little more than 1 percent of the $1.15 trillion in total U.S. exports.
Democrats and their union backers fear that congressional approval of the accord will signal that free-trade deals are possible with almost any country, no matter how low its wages or how inadequate its labor protections. House Minority Leader Nancy Pelosi, D-Calif., warned that the political consequences will come back to haunt Bush.
"It will be a pyrrhic victory for him, because we will take our message to the American people that we are the ones looking out for them," Pelosi said before the debate.
In Wednesday night's debate, proponents cited the fact that CAFTA is the latest in a series of free-trade deals with individual countries - including Jordan, Singapore, Chile and Australia - that Congress has approved in recent years. They demanded to know why opponents would not give the same favorable treatment to neighboring countries. Although CAFTA might not be perfect, "On the whole this agreement does much more for Central America than we will have the opportunity to do for a long time to come," said Rep. James P. Moran Jr., D-Va.
Supporters also hammered home the argument that most imported goods from Central America already enter the U.S. market duty-free, under the Caribbean Basin Initiative. CAFTA "levels the playing field," contended Rep. Ron Lewis, R-Ky., because it would immediately eliminate the tariffs imposed by Central American nations on 80 percent of their industrial imports from the United States, and 50 percent of the agricultural imports.
Opponents retorted that CAFTA differs from accords such as the ones with Morocco and Australia. "This is the first agreement in which we would move backwards in enforcing international labor standards," said Rep. Benjamin Cardin, D-Md., noting that the provisions requiring Central American countries to protect worker rights are weaker than those under the Caribbean initiative.
Others drew on the unpopularity of an older free-trade deal - the one with Mexico, which is often blamed, rightly or wrongly, for the loss of jobs south of the border. "CAFTA is NAFTA's ugly cousin," said Rep. Walter B. Jones Jr., R-N.C., who said he was speaking on behalf of "the 200,000 North Carolinians who have lost their jobs due to NAFTA."
But the critics were unable to prevail in the face of the GOP leaders' legislative steamroller.
Pro-CAFTA forces gained additional momentum Wednesday afternoon when the House passed, 255 to 168, a bill that would give U.S. firms expanded means to seek duties on imports from China and other "non-market" economies. The bill was promised by GOP leaders to Rep. Phil English, R-Pa., in exchange for his vote in favor of CAFTA, together with those of a handful of others from industrial states. Democrats had blocked the bill Tuesday when it came to the floor under special rules requiring a two-thirds vote, but it sailed through Wednesday under the regular rules.
Pomeroy said sugar put up a good fight and that the Bush administration will likely think twice before offering further trade agreements that are detrimental to sugar.
2005-07-28 11:36 | User Profile
The thing that just kills me about this is that the government doesn't even feel the need to pretend that there is a sound economic rationale behind this agreement.
[QUOTE=Blond Knight] "Mothers and fathers in El Salvador love their children as much as we love our children here," Bush said, stressing the need to look out for the young democracies in "our neighborhood," according to lawmakers. He also noted that four of the six countries - the Dominican Republic, El Salvador, Honduras and Nicaragua - have assisted the U.S. military effort in Iraq. So effin' what! Why does the amount of love felt by mothers and fathers in El Salvador have anything to do with US trade policy? What a moron.
2005-07-28 14:19 | User Profile
Anyone seen a list of the 17 or so Republicans that voted against the measure? I think they each deserve a note of thanks.
2005-07-28 16:17 | User Profile
[QUOTE=Texas Dissident]Anyone seen a list of the 17 or so Republicans that voted against the measure? I think they each deserve a note of thanks.[/QUOTE]
27 actually:
Boustany Capito Coble Cubin Foxx Goode Gutknecht Hostettler Hunter Jindal Jones (NC) LoBiondo Mack McCotter McHenry McHugh Miller (MI) Ney Norwood Otter Paul Rehberg Sanders Simmons Simpson Smith (NJ) Tancredo
2005-07-28 16:54 | User Profile
"[B]Approval of CAFTA handed a victory to Bush at a time when his clout on Capitol Hill has been called into question, and it also gave a badly needed boost to his broader free-trade agenda. The White House is hoping to hammer out a free-trade accord encompassing all the nations of the Western Hemisphere."[/B]
The new Oceania? Somehow, Bush has it in his head that creating unemployment for Americans is good for America.
2005-07-28 18:59 | User Profile
[QUOTE]Anyone seen a list of the 17 or so Republicans that voted against the measure? I think they each deserve a note of thanks.[/QUOTE]
C'mon, Tex. You'd be far more justified in holding your nose and sending a mash note to the Democrats; since [I]they're [/I] the ones who even made this a fight at all.
[QUOTE]During Wednesday night's debate, which lasted 2 1/2 hours, the intensity of their opposition shone through in emotional condemnations such as that by Rep. Dennis Kucinich, D-Ohio, who thundered: [B]"CAFTA is for multinational companies who want to make a profit by shutting plants in the United States and moving to places with cheap labor."[/B]
Before the vote, [B]GOP leaders[/B], who had negotiated a number of deals in recent days to sway Republicans, [B]made it clear they were prepared to twist arms and, if necessary, extend the voting period[/B].
"It will be a tough vote, [B]but we will pass CAFTA tonight," House Majority Leader Tom DeLay, R-Texas, told reporters [/B] Wednesday morning. Asked how long the vote would be kept open, DeLay replied, "When we get to 218," one vote in excess of a majority.
Underscoring the importance President Bush attaches to the pact, he [made] a rare appearance with Vice President Dick Cheney during the weekly closed-door meeting of the House Republican Conference. The president spoke for an hour.
[B]"Mothers and fathers in El Salvador love their children as much as we love our children here," Bush said[/B], stressing the need to look out for the young democracies in "our neighborhood," according to lawmakers.
Rep. Collin Peterson, D-Minn., said earlier Wednesday that for the first time in 50 years, this year the United States will import more agricultural goods than it exports. He fears CAFTA will only add to the growing trade deficit.
"I'm all for trade, but we've got to be smart about this. [B]We just keep giving everything away[/B]," said Peterson. [/QUOTE] And here's your fatal flaw in the Jeboo-shouters like Bush. Everything is viewed through Armageddon-colored glasses, blithely stumbling past one all-or-nothing landmine after another until he steps on the one that goes [B]kablooey[/B]. There is, at present, NO ONE - not one cabinet member or key adviser or administration crony - with either the candor, the caution, the clarity or the courage ...in other words, not one [U]conservative[/U]....to tell Bush, "Mr President, I urge you to rethink this before it's too late. By signing this treaty, you are making America more vulnerable at a time she cannot afford any further self-inflicted damage. You are playing with dynamite here, and may well be endangering this country's future."
But what would it matter? Rapture Bunny Bush would only reply “Well, if 'tacofication' blows up in our faces, it will be because the Lord has an even greater plan for us in store; I truly believe that.” I.E., the four horsemen of the Apocalypse and millions of Judeo-Christians floating off the ground to safety.
Regarding CAFTA, and [I]perpetual war for perpetual peace[/I].....I don’t mean to crib from Edward Gibbon, but....from my Bush campaign-speech spoof of last year:
[QUOTE]Today, workers change jobs, even careers, many times during their lives, and in one of the most dramatic shifts our society has seen, two-thirds of all Moms [COLOR=Indigo]now must [/COLOR] also work outside the home. This changed world can be a time of great opportunity for all Americans to earn a better living, support your family, and have a rewarding career, [COLOR=Indigo]in the way that being hunted for sport by Jivaro cannibals provides a great opportunity to hone your survival instincts, camouflage techniques and basic outdoorsmanship.[/COLOR]
We now compete in a global market that provides new buyers for our goods, but new competition for our workers. To create more jobs in America, America must be the best place in the world to do business. [COLOR=Indigo]That means skilled positions becoming minimum-wage jobs filled by H1-B workers: curry niggers.[/COLOR] To create jobs, my plan will encourage investment and expansion by restraining federal spending, reducing regulation, and making tax relief permanent. [COLOR=Indigo]That means the whole country's one potential landfill with a FOR SALE sign on it. [/COLOR] To create jobs, we will expand trade and level the playing field to sell American goods and services across the globe. [COLOR=Indigo]That means manufacturing those American goods in Kuala Lumpur and outsourcing those American services to Bangladesh[/COLOR]. And we must protect small business owners and workers from the explosion of frivolous lawsuits that threaten jobs across America. [COLOR=Indigo]Small businesses like Haliburton and Harken Energy, i.e., the 'little guy'.[/COLOR]
In a new term, I will lead a bipartisan effort to reform and simplify the federal tax code. [COLOR=Indigo]I also will strive to overturn legislation currently making it a federal crime to make the stock market go up and down. I had an uncle who could do it at parties and it was just about the funniest thing you ever saw.[/COLOR]
Another priority in a new term will be to help workers take advantage of the expanding economy to find better, higher-paying jobs. In this time of change, [COLOR=Indigo]ten dollars an hour will seem like real money [/COLOR] and make many workers want to go back to school to learn different or higher-level skills. So we will double the number of people served by our principal job training program and increase funding for community colleges. I know that with the right skills, American workers can compete with anyone [COLOR=Indigo]sewing Nike logos onto 1500 baseball caps a day[/COLOR], anywhere in the world.
These changing times can be exciting times of expanded opportunity. [COLOR=Indigo]As can a complete economic collapse, or an outbreak of plague, or a meteor attack[/COLOR]. In this time of change, opportunity in some communities is more distant than in others. To stand with workers in poor communities and those that have lost manufacturing, textile, and other jobs we will create American opportunity zones. In these areas, we'll provide [COLOR=Indigo]liquor stores and Armed Forces induction centers to help ease the misery, [/COLOR] tax relief [COLOR=Indigo]to Jew slumlords [/COLOR] and other incentives [COLOR=Indigo]to attract the usual gook/hindu-run new business[/COLOR].
After more than a decade of diplomacy, we gave Saddam Hussein another chance, a final chance, to meet his responsibilities to the civilized world [COLOR=Indigo]by turning his country over to Israeli management and then promptly having himself executed on closed-circuit tv[/COLOR]. He again refused, and I faced the kind of decision that comes only to the Oval Office; a decision no president would ask for, but must be prepared to make - [COLOR=Indigo]a phone call to Ariel Sharon[/COLOR]. Do I forget the lessons of September 11th and take the word of a madman, or do I take action to defend our country [COLOR=Indigo]and take the word of another madman? [/COLOR] Faced with that choice, I will [COLOR=Indigo]go with the Jew and [/COLOR] defend America every time.
Because we acted to defend our country, the murderous regimes of Saddam Hussein and the Taliban are history, more than 50 million people have been liberated [COLOR=Indigo]at the point of a gun[/COLOR], and democracy is coming to the broader Middle East [COLOR=Indigo]on the back of a tank[/COLOR]. In Afghanistan, terrorists have done everything they can to intimidate people yet more than 10 million citizens have registered to vote in the October presidential election a resounding endorsement of democracy, [COLOR=Indigo]after which their children were returned to them essentially unharmed[/COLOR]. Despite ongoing acts of violence, Iraq now has a strong-[COLOR=Indigo]smelling handpicked stooge of a [/COLOR] Prime Minister, a national council [COLOR=Indigo]who stick closely to the script[/COLOR], and [COLOR=Indigo]the usual bogus [/COLOR] national elections are scheduled for January. Our Nation is standing with the people of Afghanistan and Iraq, because when America gives its word [COLOR=Indigo]to Israel[/COLOR], America must keep its word [COLOR=Indigo]to Israel, no matter how many enemies they point out for us to kill.[/COLOR] As importantly, we are serving a vital and historic cause that will make our country safer [COLOR=Indigo]in about a hundred years or so[/COLOR]. Free societies in the Middle East will be hopeful societies [COLOR=Indigo]-hopeful that we let our guard down at some point - [/COLOR] which no longer feed resentments and breed violence for export but instead unify the entire Muslim world towards a single purpose. [COLOR=Indigo]We're kinda hoping that purpose will be 'celebrating the democratic process'. [/COLOR] [/QUOTE]
2005-07-28 19:26 | User Profile
The country is being sold off piece by piece until the only employer left in town will be the US Armed Forces.
2005-07-29 09:46 | User Profile
[SIZE=7][COLOR=Red]Treason![/COLOR][/SIZE]
xmetalhead is Right: [QUOTE]The country is being sold off piece by piece until the only employer left in town will be the US Armed Forces.[/QUOTE]
2005-07-29 11:23 | User Profile
[QUOTE=il ragno]C'mon, Tex. You'd be far more justified in holding your nose and sending a mash note to the Democrats; since *they're * the ones who even made this a fight at all.[/QUOTE] Well, you have a point except that the Democrats opposed the agreement out of partisanship more than principle. Both parties have an ideological commitment to 'free trade.' Clinton gave us NAFTA, Bush gave us CAFTA, and the next president (regardless of his party) will give us the SHAFTA.
2005-07-29 11:41 | User Profile
TEX---Your fellow Lutheran layman Sherrod Brown, D-Ohio 13, deserves credit for pulling a bi-partisan coalition of Southern and Western Republicans together to almost defeat CAFTA.
Sherrod is a very estimable "White" Democrat; in reality Sherrod is "Whiter" than I am. :blush:
The downside with Sherrod is that he does suffer from Ivy League induced noblesse oblige. But, he did graduate from Johnny Appleseed High School in Mansfield, Ohio. So there is some balance.
[QUOTE=EDUMAKATEDMOFO]27 actually:
Boustany Capito Coble Cubin Foxx Goode Gutknecht Hostettler Hunter Jindal Jones (NC) LoBiondo Mack McCotter McHenry McHugh Miller (MI) Ney Norwood Otter Paul Rehberg Sanders Simmons Simpson Smith (NJ) Tancredo[/QUOTE]
2005-07-29 11:43 | User Profile
[COLOR=Indigo][I][B][FONT=Arial] - "But what would it matter? Rapture Bunny Bush would only reply ââ¬ÅWell, if 'tacofication' blows up in our faces, it will be because the Lord has an even greater plan for us in store; I truly believe that.ââ¬Â I.E., the four horsemen of the Apocalypse and millions of Judeo-Christians floating off the ground to safety."[/FONT][/B][/I][/COLOR]
Ragno, why do you continue to pretend that Bush is a Christian? Here you can see him worshipping in a Shinto shrine:
[url]http://www.cephasministry.com/nwo_bush_goes_to_shinto_worship.html[/url]
Here you can see him celebrating Ozzy Osbourne in the White House:
[url]http://www.cuttingedge.org/news/n1758.cfm[/url]
More on the non-existent Christian faith of Bush:
[url]http://www.geocities.com/a_christian_conservative/bush-pro-islam.html[/url]
[url]http://www.cuttingedge.org/news/n1463.cfm[/url]
Mocking Dubya as a "Christian" is a blatant strawman against genuine Bible-believers.
Petr
2005-07-29 12:52 | User Profile
[QUOTE=Quantrill]Well, you have a point except that the Democrats opposed the agreement out of partisanship more than principle. Both parties have an ideological commitment to 'free trade.' Clinton gave us NAFTA, Bush gave us CAFTA, and the next president (regardless of his party) will give us the SHAFTA.[/QUOTE]
Q, President Hillary will have to use a strap-on to give us the SHAFTA..... but I think she's familiarized with that process :shocking:
2005-07-29 19:38 | User Profile
[QUOTE=Pennsylvania_Dutch]TEX---Your fellow Lutheran layman Sherrod Brown, D-Ohio 13, deserves credit for pulling a bi-partisan coalition of Southern and Western Republicans together to almost defeat CAFTA.
Sherrod is a very estimable "White" Democrat; in reality Sherrod is "Whiter" than I am. :blush: [/QUOTE]
Granted I'm a registered Republican, but I still consider myself an old-school Southern Democrat. If there were some way we could put together the America First economics of some of the Demos with the social conservatism in the GOP, then I'd have me a party I could really get behind.
2005-07-31 13:25 | User Profile
[QUOTE=Texas Dissident]Granted I'm a registered Republican, but I still consider myself an old-school Southern Democrat. If there were some way we could put together the America First economics of some of the Demos with the social conservatism in the GOP, then I'd have me a party I could really get behind.[/QUOTE] The New Yorker expose of AIPAC the jew homeland lobby & spy network sure has been swept under the rug. I wonder who "really" wrote the New Yorker story, and who all edited and contributed to it?
By the same token the blogs, written by rural mid-western, Appalachian, and Southern College graduates are getting harsher and harsher on legal and illegal immigration. Words like, damn, bastards, and phrases like "no shit" are becoming more and more common in these genuine opinion pieces.