← Autodidact Archive · Original Dissent · JoseyWales
Thread ID: 18403 | Posts: 12 | Started: 2005-05-26
2005-05-26 01:29 | User Profile
Somehow ol mo sleez will slither out of this, but i hope some of it sticks.
According to the report in the McCurtain County, Okla., paper, the documents address the monitoring of the bombing by FBI informants, Alabama attorney Morris Dees and Dees' organization, the Southern Poverty Law Center.
[url]http://www.worldnetdaily.com/news/article.asp?ARTICLE_ID=44444[/url]
2005-05-26 22:57 | User Profile
JoseyWales,
I think Morris Dees is the least important part of this story, if this turns out to be true it could be a big event. This story could damage the US government big time. If the OKC bombing was a "sting" gone bad... I do not know waht to think about what the results of this news could be... :shocking:
I mean think about what this would mean for the FBI and SPLC...
2005-05-27 03:14 | User Profile
[QUOTE=Faust]JoseyWales,
I think Morris Dees is the least important part of this story, if this turns out to be true it could be a big event. This story could damage the US government big time. If the OKC bombing was a "sting" gone bad... I do not know waht to think about what the results of this news could be... :shocking:
I mean think about what this would mean for the FBI and SPLC...[/QUOTE]
Yeah this is going to be interesting
[QUOTE]The agency further argued that revealing the elements of its intelligence-gathering operation at Elohim City would not be in the best interests of the nation. [/QUOTE]
Do I sense a Patriot Act type coverup coming on?
2005-05-27 10:34 | User Profile
That story - and Jesse Trentadue's pit bull persistence - is a political ICBM with the potential to vaporize the guilty.
Hopefully, this will ensure that Mr. Seligman-Dees and the feebs will all get what's coming to them at long last.
2005-05-28 18:59 | User Profile
The really interesting thing to note here is when Mr. Trentadue comes forward with his photocopies (which I would really like to see myself, to get a better idea of their import) of the seemingly quite damaging teletypes, the FBI does not respond in the characteristic fashion of denying their validity and pronouncing them forgeries, but rather expresses reluctance to release the originals, thus apparently verifying the authenticity of the photocopies.
[url=http://www.halturnershow.com/SPLCImplicatedInOKCBombing.html]Link[/url]
FBI has secret docs it's reticent to give up: Judge ordered disclosure of info on informants that could shed light on Oklahoma City tragedy
May 25, 2005
The FBI says it has located 340 documents related to the bombing of the Oklahoma City federal building in 1995, documents that could reveal damaging information about what the agency and its informants knew about the mass murder plot, reports the McCurtain Daily Gazette.
According to the report in the McCurtain County, Okla., paper, the documents address the monitoring of the bombing by FBI informants, Alabama attorney Morris Dees and Dees' organization, the Southern Poverty Law Center. Writes reporter J.D. Cash in the Gazette: "If proven true, the ramifications of such disclosures would be far-reaching. Not only could the discovery of these documents lead to additional arrests and prosecutions in the OKC bombing case, but evidence of a cover-up of a sting operation involving the FBI and a private charity ( the SPLC) could ruin a number of careers of highly placed individuals."
The documents are part of an extensive filing made in federal court in Salt Lake City, Utah, on Monday. A court order was obtained by Salt Lake City attorney Jesse Trentadue, the plaintiff in a Freedom of Information suit against the Oklahoma City FBI office, the Gazette reported. Trentadue has been seeking evidence in the untimely death of his brother, whose body was found beaten and slashed while the inmate awaited a parole violation hearing.
Trentadue believes his brother was tortured and killed by government agents who mistakenly thought he was involved with executed killer Timothy McVeigh and others in a string of bank robberies and the bombing of the Oklahoma City federal building.
After learning the FBI was involved in a sting operation with the Southern Poverty Law Center, Trentadue, the Gazette reports, sought a copy of two teletypes from former FBI Director Louis Freeh that discussed the undercover operation "that proved the FBI knew in advance McVeigh's plans for bombing a federal building."
The FBI initially denied it had the teletypes, but after Trentadue produced redacted copies of them, he went to court to force the FBI to cough up copies of their original un-redacted versions.
On May 5, U.S. District Court Judge Dale A. Kimball ordered the FBI to turn over un-redacted copies of two teletypes sent by Freeh to a select group of FBI field offices, including the OKBOMB task force in Oklahoma City. Kimball's order also included instructions to perform an extensive search for other records involving McVeigh, his alleged co-conspirators and informants working for the Southern Poverty Law Center.
The paper reported that, according to a Jan. 4, 1996, teletype, Freeh disclosed the Southern Poverty Law Center had an informant at the white supremacist Elohim City compound when McVeigh called the facility requesting assistance with his plans. The teletype said the call was made on April 17, 1995 ââ¬â 48 hours before a truck bomb destroyed the Murrah Federal Building, killing 168 persons and injuring 500 more.
For years, the FBI has repeatedly denied the agency had any prior knowledge of the bomb plot.
The FBI now says it has found 340 documents that could also link the SPLC to McVeigh, Elohim City and members of the Aryan Republican Army.
On Monday, the FBI proposed several alternatives to turning over the documents listed in Kimball's order, saying it did not have time to comply with the judge's order to turn over the material Trentadue is seeking by June 15.
Said an agency representative: "In the past, the backlog in the FOIPA Section has been exacerbated by the high volume of administrative appeals that will require review and response by the FBI's FOIPA Section personnel. ââ¬Â¦ At the present time, the FBI is involved in over 150 pending lawsuits in various federal district and appellate courts throughout the United States."
The agency further argued that revealing the elements of its intelligence-gathering operation at Elohim City would not be in the best interests of the nation.
2005-05-30 07:22 | User Profile
Uncovering A Justice Department Cover-Up
By Paul Craig Roberts
[See also The Trentadue Case: A Coverup That Wonââ¬â¢t Stay Covered, December 02, 2003 ]
In 1995, Kenneth Trentadue was murdered by federal agents in a federal prison in Oklahoma City. A cover-up immediately went into effect. Federal authorities claimed Trentadue, who was being held in a suicide-proof cell, had committed suicide by hanging himself, but the state coroner would not buy the story.
Prison authorities tried to get family consent to cremate the body. But Trentadue had been picked up on a minor parole violation, and the story of suicide by a happily married man delighted with his two-month-old son raised red flags to the family.
When the Trentadue family received Kenneth's body and heavy makeup was scraped away, the evidence (available in photos on the Internet) clearly shows a person who had been tortured and beaten. His throat was slashed, and he may have been garroted. There are bruises, burns and cuts from the soles of Trentadue's feet to his head, wounds that obviously were not self-inflicted.
As the state coroner noted at the time, every investigative rule was broken by the federal prison. The coroner was not allowed into the cell, and the cell was scrubbed down prior to investigation.
The federal cover-up was completely transparent. A U.S. senator made inquiries, but the U.S. Department of Justice (sic), knowing that it would not be held accountable, stuck to its fabricated story.
That was a mistake. Trentadue's brother, Jesse, is an attorney. He believes that federal officials, like everyone else, must be held accountable for their crimes. He has been battling the Justice (sic) Department and the FBI for a decade.
Jesse Trentadue has amassed evidence that his brother was mistaken for Tim McVeigh's alleged accomplice in the bombing of the federal building in Oklahoma City. Federal agents, believing that they had Richard Lee Guthrie in their hands, went too far in attempting to force him to talk.
Jesse Trentadue learned that the FBI had informants planted with two groups on which McVeigh may have relied: a white supremacist paramilitary training compound at Elohim City in Oklahoma and the Mid-West Bank Robbery Gang. The implication is that the FBI had advance notice of McVeigh's plans and may have been conducting a sting operation that went awry.
The FBI has documents that name the informants. Teletypes from then-FBI Director Louis Freeh dated Jan. 4, 1996, and Aug. 23, 1996, confirm that the FBI had informants imbedded with the Mid-West Bank Robbery Gang and in Elohim City. In these documents, Freeh reports to various FBI field offices that the Elohim City informant (possibly explosives expert and German national Andreas Carl Strassmeir) "allegedly has had a lengthy relationship with Timothy McVeigh" and "that McVeigh had placed a telephone call to Elohim City on 4/5/95, a day that he was believed to have been attempting to recruit a second conspirator to assist in the OKBOMB attack."
The FBI denied to federal judge Dale Kimball that any such documents existed. But someone had leaked them to Trentadue, and he put them before the judge along with an affidavit of their genuineness. Caught red-handed lying to a federal judge, the FBI was ordered to produce all documents Trentadue demanded. Kimball gave the FBI until June 15, 2005, to deliver the incriminating records. Needless to say, the FBI doesn't want to deliver and is attempting every possible dodge to escape obeying the judge's order.
In his effort to uncover the DOJ's cover-up of his brother's murder, Jesse Trentadue may have uncovered evidence of the FBI's failure to prevent the bombing of the Murrah Building. It is bad enough that the murder of Kenneth Trentadue is covered over with many layers of DOJ perjury and the withholding and destruction of evidence.
Evidence that the FBI was aware of McVeigh's plan to bomb the Murrah Building and failed to prevent the deed would be an additional heavy blow to the prestige of federal law enforcement.
Paul Craig Roberts, a former Reagan Administration official, is the author of The Supply-Side Revolution and, with Lawrence M. Stratton, of The Tyranny of Good Intentions : How Prosecutors and Bureaucrats Are Trampling the Constitution in the Name of Justice. Click here for Peter Brimelowââ¬â¢s Forbes Magazine interview with Roberts about the recent epidemic of prosecutorial misconduct.
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[url]http://www.vdare.com/roberts/050526_uncovering.htm[/url]
2005-05-31 16:23 | User Profile
Gosh, FOX News hasn't said anything about this, so it must not be important.
Like the Michael Jackson trial...
2005-06-01 06:44 | User Profile
The way I see it, when law enforcement "authorities" step over the line, they need to be harshly disciplined through vigilante action. They need to be made to suffer.
If federal, state, or local pigs ever harmed one of my family members, each pig responsible would get a very unpleasant visit from me when he least expected it. It might be days, weeks, months, or even years after the crime, but it would happen. Man, would it ever happen.
2005-06-01 17:04 | User Profile
Angler? sometimes it even takes 38 years but when it happens and they remember what they have forgotten then it the time for you to smile.
2005-06-01 19:39 | User Profile
[QUOTE=Faust] Jesse Trentadue learned that the FBI had informants planted with two groups on which McVeigh may have relied: a white supremacist paramilitary training compound at Elohim City in Oklahoma and the Mid-West Bank Robbery Gang. The implication is that the FBI had advance notice of McVeigh's plans and may have been conducting a sting operation that went awry.
The FBI has documents that name the informants. Teletypes from then-FBI Director Louis Freeh dated Jan. 4, 1996, and Aug. 23, 1996, confirm that the FBI had informants imbedded with the Mid-West Bank Robbery Gang and in Elohim City. In these documents, Freeh reports to various FBI field offices that the Elohim City informant (possibly explosives expert and German national Andreas Carl Strassmeir) "allegedly has had a lengthy relationship with Timothy McVeigh" and "that McVeigh had placed a telephone call to Elohim City on 4/5/95, a day that he was believed to have been attempting to recruit a second conspirator to assist in the OKBOMB attack."[/QUOTE] I wouldn't be at all surprised if the moles were the ones who were the impetus behind the attack, such as in the Matt Hale case, which was basically entrapment. Anything to get them white supremacists.
2005-08-25 02:19 | User Profile
These countryboys Alex Linder of VNN, and J.D. Cash of the McCurtin Daily Gazette are coming close to forcing the lid off of what could be one of the biggest scandals in American political history. [url]http://mccurtain.com/articles/2005/08/18/top_story/top001.txt[/url]
If this scandal blows, Gore Vidal will have bragging rights too.
2005-08-25 06:47 | User Profile
OKBOMB case now open again, bombing documents ordered turned over to judge
By J.D. Cash
A U.S. District Court judge in Salt Lake City, Utah, has ordered the Oklahoma City FBI office to turn over unredacted copies of all documents currently at issue in a Freedom of Information (FOIA) lawsuit involving additional evidence and the names of additional conspirators in the Oklahoma City bombing case.
According to the judge, the materials would be reviewed in his chambers and then returned to the FBI.
The order could also include evidence in the possession of the FBI that might shed light on the mysterious death of an inmate, Kenny Trentadue, who was being held at the Federal Transfer Center in Oklahoma City in 1995.
Contacted about whether the agency would comply with the order or appeal it, FBI Special Agent Gary Johnson made a startling announcement. After declining to comment on the civil matters involved in the Trentadue suit, Johnson said the FBI was currently investigating the April 19, 1995, bombing.
In the past, Johnson has told the media that the FBI was standing by its original investigation. "It was the most experienced and thorough in our history," he said.
The $85 million effort yielded only two federal convictions, Terry Nichols and Tim McVeigh. Mike Fortier provided testimony against McVeigh and Nichols in return for a reduced sentence.
Asked how many FBI agents were involved in the renewed effort, Johnson simply commented: "We don't ever disclose that type of information."
Exactly when this investigation was opened and why remains unclear.
In 2000, the head of the original OKBOMB investigation, Danny Defenbaugh, told an interviewer for a documentary film on the subject that, "The FBI will never reopen the case, under any circumstances. Even if McVeigh calls and gives us names," Defenbaugh stated, "we will never reopen it."
A civil suit filed by a Utah attorney may have flushed out new evidence of a wider conspiracy in the bombing, forcing the agency to move forward with a new investigation.
The deceased brother of a murdered inmate, Jesse Trentadue, sued the Oklahoma City FBI office after attempting to obtain documents concerning the death of his younger brother Kenny.
At the time of his death, Trentadue was being held in solitary confinement in the Oklahoma City Federal Transfer Center, pending a hearing on his parole status. The government has since claimed Trentadue killed himself.
Jesse Trentadue, an attorney in Salt Lake City, Utah, claims he has found evidence that his brother was tortured and killed because federal agents suspected him of involvement in the bombing conspiracy in Oklahoma City. Trentadue received the information from a person close to McVeigh, who was waiting execution at the time.
Additional evidence to support this claim could be available soon.
In an order dated Aug. 16, U.S. District Judge Dale A. Kimball directed the parties to appear before him on Oct. 12 to present additional arguments on whether the FBI is entitled to continue withholding evidence it may have of a wider conspiracy in the matter n and much more.
Kimball also ordered the FBI to bring to court all unredacted copies of the documents involved in the litigation for him to review in his chambers.
Trentadue's litigation thus far has uncovered links between McVeigh and several subjects that frequented Elohim City, a paramilitary training camp in eastern Oklahoma.
For a decade since the bombing, senior FBI agents and lawyers for the U.S. Department of Justice have argued that they never had any evidence that persons at Elohim City could be involved with McVeigh or the Oklahoma bombing.
But several weeks ago, a court order from Kimball forced the release of approximately 100 pages of documents by the Oklahoma City FBI office and some do indeed appear to implicate others in the bombing.
However, the FBI has blacked out almost every name in those documents, along with whole sentences of other information regarding an undercover operation the FBI and others were involved with.
In the documents, the FBI also notes the agency is monitoring McVeigh and Elohim City with the help of the Southern Poverty Law Center. The SPLC is a tax-exempt civil rights group that was co-founded by Alabama attorney Morris Dees.
Dees confirmed participation in a covert operation at Elohim City, but refused to elaborate during an interview with this newspaper almost two years ago.
During the course of this litigation, Justice Department lawyers have also argued that the individuals working for the SPLC and the FBI were promised anonymity in return for their undercover work, thus their names were blacked out to protect their identities.
Trentadue has told the court that the public's interest in learning who killed 168 persons and injured 500 more in Oklahoma City in 1995, far outweighs the FBI's interest in protecting the names of its informants n especially those employed by a private organization.