← Autodidact Archive · Original Dissent · Bardamu
Thread ID: 15271 | Posts: 88 | Started: 2004-10-10
2004-10-10 15:29 | User Profile
Was the Phora just a shooting star? I kinda liked that website. :sad:
2004-10-10 15:47 | User Profile
Let's not jump to conclusions. Perhaps this is just temporary technical hassle down there.
(Fade wrote yesterday that there were going to be some structural changes soon)
Petr
2004-10-10 16:02 | User Profile
Yeah, I know, probably just a technical thing ... but did you notice the low traffic level yesterday?
Plus, I guess I owe you an apology from a previous thread when I accused you of crowing over the Phora's demise (an earlier one :D), which, upon my rereading the thread in question from OD, you actually weren't. So I was inadvertently bearing "false witness".
2004-10-10 16:11 | User Profile
Thank you, apology accepted.
And I myself don't usually pay that much attention to "traffic levels" than the quality of debates.
We're not into crowd-pleasing business down there anyways, right?
Some slump is unevitable now that the frankly tedious Third-Reich spam is going away.
Petr
2004-10-10 16:18 | User Profile
The slump was intense, so Fade may have reacted by pulling the plug. He appears to be rather tired of his duties as owner/operator. But of course this is all premature and we wiill see. Although, to tell the truth, I doubt if he can stay off the net for long.
2004-10-10 16:50 | User Profile
[COLOR=DarkRed] - " The slump was intense, so Fade may have reacted by pulling the plug. "[/COLOR]
I'd be quite (negatively) surprised if it were so - Fade and I were still in the middle of a debate when I checked in last morning!
Petr
2004-10-11 21:04 | User Profile
[QUOTE=Petr]
Some slump is unevitable now that the frankly tedious Third-Reich spam is going away.
Petr[/QUOTE]
Is all that SeigHeil88 type crap going to be deleted, when I visited that site it read like the VNN forums rather than a splinter from OD? It was worse than Stormfront for having to search through pages of tripe to find a meaningful post.
2004-10-12 03:05 | User Profile
[QUOTE=Petr][COLOR=DarkRed] - " The slump was intense, so Fade may have reacted by pulling the plug. "[/COLOR]
I'd be quite (negatively) surprised if it were so - Fade and I were still in the middle of a debate when I checked in last morning!
Petr[/QUOTE]Seems like its up now.
2004-10-12 12:33 | User Profile
[QUOTE=Okiereddust]Seems like its up now.[/QUOTE]
Yes, it is. I jumped the gun.
2004-12-13 18:20 | User Profile
[url]http://www.thephora.org/forum/showpost.php?p=50237&postcount=87[/url]
Neoconservative -- Any American who does not like Saddam Hussein, likes Roosevelt, does not hate the Jews, does not believe Hitler was right, does not cringe at the American flag, does not listen to Skrewdriver or Anal Cunt. That's a lot of neoconservatives.
Reviewing the thread over there on OD and come across this.
Give me a freakin' break. I gotta ask, who is taking this guy fade the butcher seriously? Anybody? He's a caricature, yucking it up with raina the jewish, lesbo troll.
Gecko, let me know when you want to come home...no worries.
2004-12-13 19:51 | User Profile
Fade's trying to fit into a niche that's so small a gnat couldn't fit through it.
The Phora: It's more Free Republic than Original Dissent....(OD being the latest outpost of NeoNazis because we don't post thread after thread after thread denouncing Hitler or VNN and we might even, [I]gasp!,[/I]tolerate a few posters who happen to agree with a few ideas of Nazi Germany or, [I]yikes!!,[/I]denounce FDR as a Zionist tool and traitor!! God, we're pusillanimous pacifists, on the verge of treason, for rejecting Bush's war on a defenseless, non-agressive, sovereign country called Iraq!!)
We're not on Fade's side of White "Communitarianism" and we'd probably be purged under his Adminstration.
2004-12-13 19:58 | User Profile
[QUOTE=xmetalhead]Fade's trying to fit into a niche that's so small a gnat couldn't fit through it.
The Phora: It's more Free Republic than Original Dissent....(OD being the latest outpost of NeoNazis because we don't post thread after thread after thread denouncing Hitler or VNN and we might even, [I]gasp!,[/I]tolerate a few posters who happen to agree with a few ideas of Nazi Germany or, [I]yikes!!,[/I]denounce FDR as a Zionist tool and traitor!! God, we're pusillanimous pacifists, on the verge of treason, for rejecting Bush's war on a defenseless, non-agressive, sovereign country called Iraq!!)
We're not on Fade's side of White "Communitarianism" and we'd probably be purged under his Adminstration.[/QUOTE]
It's really become a comedy, though a sad one at that. I really feel for those who have left us in the past to go over there. I still think all his posing is just a rich, fratboy's intellectual exercise, but whatever the motivation it is intolerable for anyone outside his coterie of sycophants.
I really hope all those who left us will come home again. OD's like that old country cottage with a warm fireplace burning off the outside cold. :)
2004-12-13 22:03 | User Profile
A lot of the posters at the Phora are constantly lambasting VNN. VNN may deserve some of the criticism but compared to OD, the Phora seems like a low caliber forum as far as intellect goes.
2004-12-13 22:12 | User Profile
[QUOTE=travis]A lot of the posters at the Phora are constantly lambasting VNN. VNN may deserve some of the criticism but compared to OD, the Phora seems like a low caliber forum as far as intellect goes.[/QUOTE]
I'm sure there are a few quality intellects there, but for the most part it's a pretty chatty board. In that vein it reminds me a good bit of Liberty Forum. The noise to quality ratio is pretty high. I can't take Liberty Forum at all.
2004-12-13 22:17 | User Profile
I've stopped posting on The Phora.
There's also The Nordish Portal:
[url]http://www.nordish.net/[/url]
2004-12-13 22:28 | User Profile
[QUOTE=Texas Dissident]I'm sure there are a few quality intellects there, but for the most part it's a pretty chatty board. In that vein it reminds me a good bit of Liberty Forum. The noise to quality ratio is pretty high. I can't take Liberty Forum at all.[/QUOTE]I'm sure they have a few quality intellectuals at VNN, too, but that's not the rule. It seems the quality is leaving the Phora, being chased out by ad hominem from the philo-semites. I think much of the noise at liberty forum is intentional disruption by those who are offended by the lack of censorship....disruption thus providing a kind of censorship in itself. I feel like I've surrendered to it myself as I no longer post there. You have done a great job of preventing those illnesses here, let me know if you could use any contributions to handle the increase in traffic OD will be getting.
2004-12-13 22:40 | User Profile
[QUOTE=travis]You have done a great job of preventing those illnesses here, let me know if you could use any contributions to handle the increase in traffic OD will be getting.[/QUOTE]
Well thank you travis, but truth be told I've made a number of mistakes trying to go in the opposite direction of the boards you mention. It's a very difficult line to try and walk.
As far any increase in traffic for OD, I've extended a welcome back, but honestly I have no idea how it will be received by those that have left. I guess we'll see.
2004-12-13 22:57 | User Profile
[QUOTE=Texas Dissident] It's a very difficult line to try and walk.
[/QUOTE]It builds character!
I don't agree with all of your decisions nor do I agree with all your positions/beliefs/values, but I can't deny that this is the best forum of it's kind I have found and that keeping it running is essential to our survival as a people.
2004-12-13 23:44 | User Profile
[QUOTE=travis]It builds character!
And grey hair counts. :)
I don't agree with all of your decisions nor do I agree with all your positions/beliefs/values, but I can't deny that this is the best forum of it's kind I have found and that keeping it running is essential to our survival as a people.[/QUOTE]
If it's the best forum its kind, then I am certain it got that way in spite of me. Thanks for your support, travis.
2004-12-14 02:10 | User Profile
[QUOTE=Texas Dissident][url]http://www.thephora.org/forum/showpost.php?p=50237&postcount=87[/url]
He's a caricature, yucking it up with raina the jewish, lesbo troll. [/QUOTE]
It is truly ridiculous.
2004-12-14 02:36 | User Profile
Fade The Butcher's Phora is only one small step above FreeRepublic, IMO. They stand for everything White and they stand for nothing White, they won't ban you for holding oppossing views (Jewish control of the media, anti-Iraq War, question American democracy and hegemony, admiring Europe) but they repudiate you if you post opposing views by simply using neo-con-ish tactics. They have a bizarre dichotomy over there. It's worth reading some posts though because of Anti-Yuppie's and Il Ragno's posts battling Fade & Co.
2004-12-14 03:37 | User Profile
[QUOTE=Bardamu]It is truly ridiculous.[/QUOTE]
Indeed it is, bardamu. They like to ridicule the VNN board for its outlandishness (and yes, it did deserve criticism), but they are just as ridiculous, albeit in a different manner.
I sure hope y'all see through that charade and quit wasting time over there. I'd like to see you back over here, Bardamu. Pls think on it.
You know what they say about the devil you know and all that... :)
2004-12-14 03:37 | User Profile
Would it be worth my time to go there in order to educate them about the Jews?,,,,,,,,heheheheheh I can be so nice.
2004-12-14 03:46 | User Profile
[QUOTE=xmetalhead]It's worth reading some posts though because of Anti-Yuppie's and Il Ragno's posts battling Fade & Co.[/QUOTE]
I'm hoping and working for that to change soon.
2004-12-14 03:48 | User Profile
[QUOTE=Texas Dissident] I sure hope y'all see through that charade and quit wasting time over there. I'd like to see you back over here, Bardamu. Pls think on it. [/QUOTE] Refuting Fade's philo-semitic nonsense is not a waste of time. I applaud Il Ragno and Anti-Yuppie for hanging in there and fighting the war of ideas. I doubt they have any ambitions of abandoning OD to chit-chat with the fools over there. We can't afford to have Fade and company herd any of our bretheren to the foolish position that there is strategic value in disregarding our most dangerous enemy. I think all of us should do our duty and spend time at VNN and Phora to bring our younger bretheren closer to reality on the most complicated racial issue we face......Jews. The sooner they get it all figured out the better.
2004-12-14 03:55 | User Profile
[QUOTE=travis]Refuting Fade's philo-semitic nonsense is not a waste of time.
You're right, travis. Good point and I do agree with that.
There's nothing wrong with being somewhat concerned over how you present yourself to others, but at some point it can become one's central focus and you invariably lose sight of what you were about in the first place. How many politicians have we seen this happen to? Anyway, that's fade the caricature's position right now.
Hopefully IR, bardamu, AY and all the others who are over there can point the way to any impressionable members there.
2004-12-14 03:57 | User Profile
[QUOTE=Texas Dissident]Indeed it is, bardamu. They like to ridicule the VNN board for its outlandishness (and yes, it did deserve criticism), but they are just as ridiculous, albeit in a different manner.
I sure hope y'all see through that charade and quit wasting time over there. I'd like to see you back over here, Bardamu. Pls think on it.
You know what they say about the devil you know and all that... :)[/QUOTE]
Thanks, TD.
2004-12-14 04:04 | User Profile
[QUOTE=Bardamu]Thanks, TD.[/QUOTE]
You're welcome, Bardamu. Maybe I shouldn't, I don't know, but I feel bad about the bill of goods some of y'all were sold on over there and the way its turned out. That along with me just missing seeing y'all around.
Granted there may still be too much water under the bridge for some, I've made more than my share of mistakes doing this thing. All I can say is that it doesn't come with a manual.
But enough of the yappin'....good to see you on the board.
2004-12-14 04:17 | User Profile
[QUOTE] [size=1][color=darkgreen][color=black]Texas Dissident:[/color] "Indeed it is, bardamu. They like to ridicule the VNN board for its outlandishness (and yes, it did deserve criticism), but they are just as ridiculous, albeit in a different manner." [/color][/size][/QUOTE][color=navy]I would like to invite you over to The Phora, gentlemen, especially you, Mr. Dissident. You will find we are unmatched on the Internet in our debating skills, and have intellectually eviscerated so many opponents by now we have lost count. So, if you think you have what it takes to meet us head on, do join us. [/color]
[color=#000080]I am known as "Nuclear Thoughts" over there, and for good reason. And, of course, you'll meet the inimitable Fade the Butcher. You may regret meeting him, but you'll meet him. [/color]
[color=#000080]Aufweidersehen! [/color]
[img]http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v222/ihn4f/NuclearThoughtsAvatar200x150xVersion333Transparent.gif[/img][url="http://www.thephora.org/forum/image.php?u=794&dateline=1102467808"][/url]
2004-12-14 04:21 | User Profile
XMH (who is "Ben Franklin" over there - hands off our great Americans, you damn dirty Frenchman!) is chillingly close to he mark when he sez:
[QUOTE]They stand for everything White and they stand for nothing White, they won't ban you for holding oppossing views (Jewish control of the media, anti-Iraq War, question American democracy and hegemony, admiring Europe) but they repudiate you if you post opposing views by simply using neo-con-ish tactics. They have a bizarre dichotomy over there. [/QUOTE]
Fade, I think, fancies himself a new-age Edward Bernays and I think he enjoys manipulating the tide of opinion (or believes he can, at any rate). There are times whern he appears to cynically believe in nothing but his Magic Powers of Persuasion, but there are others where he seems almost surprised that some of his points are actually constructive and make sense. His nuzzling Raina the Viper to his breast is absolutely disgusting and I can't figure out why to save my life. Maybe he's trying to set himself up with a girl in every port - I dunno. (At least, if he was simply working on getting laid I could excuse it.)
Word to the wise: if that [I]is[/I] the reason, Fade, wear [I]two [/I] jimmy-hats. Or prepare to lose a lot of weight really really quickly afterwards.
[QUOTE]I really hope all those who left us will come home again. OD's like that old country cottage with a warm fireplace burning off the outside cold.
As far any increase in traffic for OD, I've extended a welcome back, but honestly I have no idea how it will be received by those that have left. I guess we'll see.[/QUOTE]
Ordinarily I'd let you down easy by suggesting [I]you're a day late and a dollar short.[/I] But I really don't see how you can expect anyone to take you up on the offer, considering that all the expats have been regularly derided here after our departure. From Walter's "good riddance" dosages of Dutch courage to Okie (who - correct me if I'm wrong - initiated a thread dedicated to poking fun of Anti-Yuppie very recently) who can always be counted to remind the world that the OD ex-pats are and were fools to make himself feel better.
And as for 'Mute....perhaps you've forgotten that he - unlike AY, who asked to have his posts removed - logged in one day to find three years worth of his contributions shitcanned into the vast reaches of cyberspace in a Texas Dissident fit of pique.
Yeah, he's just [I]waiting [/I] to be asked back to the prom.
I can't quite explain why [B]I [/B] continue to make cameo appearances here. Maybe I simply can't shut up...makes about as much sense as any other reason I can come up with. But a full-blown return? Why - so I can get Petr in stereo? I get all the Petr I can abide [I]now[/I], at the Phora.
Look, you guys made your bed. I could've - and did, I think - warn you that board activity would dwindle down to a trickle. You said fine. You said good riddance. Your love of the Lord would suffice. You were going to take out little ads in small-press magazines, and you'd rebuild [I]that [/I] way. I suggest you follow your own counsel, because way too much bad blood has been spilled for any Old Home Week to happen here.
Tex began a thread in another folder - I haven't read it, I just noticed the title: WHAT HAPPENED TO CONSERVATIVES? Well, I don't need to click the link to answer the question.
Infighting, anomie and -inevitably - atomization happened.
The [I]enemy [/I] became the other conservative standing next to you.....the one who didn't march in lockstep with you every step of the way, but only shared an essential commonality with you. But Walter can tell you all about that. There was no more strident voice calling for complete and total unaninimity...the OD Minister of Pointing Out Infidels. With Okie as his chief bagman and thug, and Tex?...well, Tex was too busy looking for that country-music lyric that would [I]perfectly [/I] encapsulate his worldview to pay very much mind. If he hadn't been so busy praying for us sinners, he might've kept his forum from tearing itself apart.
2004-12-14 04:45 | User Profile
[QUOTE=General Rommel] You will find we are unmatched on the Internet in our debating skills, and have intellectually eviscerated so many opponents by now we have lost count. So, if you think you have what it takes to meet us head on, do join us. [/QUOTE]
Yea, join The Phora where the motto is: "Enforcing White Communitarianism by the Rhetorical Point of the Tongue."
PS. I post as "BenFranklin" at The Phora.
2004-12-14 05:12 | User Profile
[QUOTE=il ragno]From Walter's "good riddance" dosages of Dutch courage to Okie (who - correct me if I'm wrong - initiated a thread dedicated to poking fun of Anti-Yuppie very recently) Or I could ask you just provide a link here and always for your bald faced assertion.
With Okie as his chief bagman and thug, and Tex?...well, Tex was too busy looking for that country-music lyric that would perfectly encapsulate his worldview to pay very much mind.
If I were philosophizing, I'd think it would be more appropro to quote Dick Vermeil "Its time to take off the diapers and get to work"
2004-12-14 05:33 | User Profile
[QUOTE=il ragno]Look, you guys made your bed. I could've - and did, I think - warn you that board activity would dwindle down to a trickle. You said fine. You said good riddance. Your love of the Lord would suffice. You were going to take out little ads in small-press magazines, and you'd rebuild [I]that [/I] way. I suggest you follow your own counsel, because way too much bad blood has been spilled for any Old Home Week to happen here.[/QUOTE]
For what its worth, I extended a welcome back not out of any concern over board activity. Think about it IR, do you think my participation level here shows that I'm real concerned about alexa numbers and such? If that were the case, don't you think I'd be on here making 50 posts a day and launching crusades against some outfit like Stormfront, VNN or Free Republic for that matter trying to make a name for myself?
No, "board activity" is hardly my concern. I figured my gesture would not sit well with everyone, but I've felt it was the right thing to do. So that and my "love of the Lord" will have to suffice, I'm sure.
Take care.
2004-12-14 05:41 | User Profile
[QUOTE=General Rommel][color=navy]I would like to invite you over to The Phora, gentlemen, especially you, Mr. Dissident. You will find we are unmatched on the Internet in our debating skills, and have intellectually eviscerated so many opponents by now we have lost count. So, if you think you have what it takes to meet us head on, do join us. [/color]
Thanks for the invite, General. This place pretty much monopolizes my web time, but I appreciate the sentiment. I have visited over there from time, but it seems the on-going arguments are things we hashed out over here 3 years ago. I've still got some scars on me.
I am known as "Nuclear Thoughts" over there, and for good reason. And, of course, you'll meet the inimitable Fade the Butcher. You may regret meeting him, but you'll meet him.
Oh I've met him. He's a senior member here. Even banned once or twice, I lose count. :) Maybe I'll invest some time arguing with him when I witness a consistent position held over, say, at least 5 or 6 months. 'Til then I've got better things to do. Back when I was in school I was just like y'all and didn't realize or take into account things like time, seasoning and long-term consistency and integrity. I'm older now and have a broader perspective. Wife and kids, mortgages and life'll do that kind of thing to you.
I'm sure you're a master debater, though. No doubt. No, sir. Thanks again and good luck.
2004-12-14 06:32 | User Profile
Nuclear Thoughts - what an idiot. Can you [I]tell [/I] he's 12 and a half years old?
Sorry, Tex. You asked a question, I answered it as honestly as I could. Bad feelings persist. Likely they will continue. And I dunno how anyone who could have presided over this place in 2002-3...when it really was the best board of its kind, and humming with activity - can say with a straight face that OD now resembling the surface of the moon is a-ok with him.
I can tell you one thing however. You won't like it, but at least you can be assured that it isn't just my bias speaking, but objective truth. There is no figure on the Cyber Right more universally loathed and disrespected than OkieReddust. I mean that quite literally: if his name is mentioned at all, anywhere, it's with disgust and contempt in every instance. (By the way, Okie, I haven't a clue where or when you made that comment; AntiYuppie brought it up to me.)
You'll doubtless defend him in your response (if you choose to respond to this) but - like they said of Goldwater - [I]in your heart you know I'm right.[/I] And you would never curtail him in any way, let alone push him out the door. I guess you're to be commended for your loyalty, blind though it may be. But it renders your 'invitations' kinda meaningless, too. "Come home, all is forgiven" rings hollow when the people you're entreating have absolutely nothing to be forgiven for; indeed, they're owed apologies.
2004-12-14 06:47 | User Profile
[QUOTE=il ragno]Sorry, Tex. You asked a question, I answered it as honestly as I could. Bad feelings persist. Likely they will continue. And I dunno how anyone who could have presided over this place in 2002-3...when it really was the best board of its kind, and humming with activity - can say with a straight face that OD now resembling the surface of the moon is a-ok with him.
It is what it is. Not one of us can go back and do over anything. I took a few months off at the end of this last summer. I'll tell you this, I don't stay up at night worrying about the board. However I do still care about each of you. Not really much more to it than that. Like I said, I just put it out there 'cause I felt it was the right thing to do. Beyond that it's not up to me, so I appreciate your honesty and we'll just keep rolling along here however slow.
I can tell you one thing however. You won't like it, but at least you can be assured that it isn't just my bias speaking, but objective truth. There is no figure on the Cyber Right more universally loathed and disrespected than OkieReddust. I mean that quite literally: if his name is mentioned at all, anywhere, it's with disgust and contempt in every instance.
Hell, I'm sure my name isn't heralded many places, either. Okie is a trusted long-time friend and confidant, and when I say long-time I mean like 8 years! That's an eternity here on the internet. Not much more needs be said on that, I guess. I don't think or know in my heart any differently.
Again, thanks for the honest reply. Maybe I'll see you around and the light's always on for you. Take care.
2004-12-14 06:51 | User Profile
I been called an "idiot" once so: make it two.
In order to "debate" you must have knowledge of the truth, not only your truth but also the truth according to the other party, in other words you must know how hot or cold the water is before you jump in.
To debate without the above is like going into battle with a rifle and no bullets.
To debate is to fight but what you really want to do is not to do battle but to "guide" the other party to your way of thinking,
Many times have I tried to have a decent conversation with a Jew and they always end up by insulting me, that's their tactic when ever either they don't know what to say or find themselves facing the truth.
And lets not forget their favorite insult,,,,,PONCE? YOU ARE NOTHING BUT AN ANTISEMITIC.,,,,,and what I like about this is that they are not really Semite Jews but Khazar Zionists,,,,,,oh well, the world still turns in circles.
2004-12-14 07:26 | User Profile
[QUOTE=xmetalhead]Fade's trying to fit into a niche that's so small a gnat couldn't fit through it. Er, no. Fade's joined a tradition that is MUCH broader than American Nazi sympathizers have ever belonged to, or ever will. Racialism was MAINSTREAM in the West before your Nazi heroes came along and stigmatized it. Fade represents a broad tendency of promoting a sensible racialist program rooted in AMERICA, within the framework of AMERICAN government, religion, and law. This is the antithesis of a "niche ideology," let alone a small one. You and your neo-Nazi ilk are the ones who belong to a discredited niche.
2004-12-14 07:36 | User Profile
[QUOTE=travis]It seems the quality is leaving the Phora, being chased out by ad hominem from the philo-semites..[/QUOTE]Thanks for the laugh. FADE ALONE has more intellectual power than all the regulars at OD COMBINED.
2004-12-14 08:32 | User Profile
Heads-up, boys: Raina's back. ("Princest")
2004-12-14 09:36 | User Profile
[QUOTE=xmetalhead]Yea, join The Phora where the motto is: "Enforcing White Communitarianism by the Rhetorical Point of the Tongue." PS. I post as "BenFranklin" at The Phora.[/QUOTE]
What is "white communitarianism" exactly?
You know, I wonder how far such a notion is from Catholic social teaching.
A healthy racial nationalism, free markets, a strong policy against monopolies both political and economic, strong marriage and kinship bonds, fanatical solidarity toward the in-group. and a generous open hand to all outsiders.
It sounds more like common sense to me than anything else.
But then again, that's not how I remember Fade's ideas expressed here, who seemed to like the Nazi totalitarian model.
Walter
2004-12-14 12:14 | User Profile
Actually, the correct title is [B]Racial Communitarianism[/B] and - regardless of its merits or demerits - it's doomed to fail for three reasons, if we bear in mind Fade's thesis that Americans naturally feel revulsion to all things Nazi and always will.
1- "Racial". Nazi ideology is built upon putting this modifier before every friggin' noun extant.
2- "Communitarianism". You show me a Fox News fan, I'll show you a person who will stop reading at "Commu-". Might as well change it to "Bolshevisualism", at least you'd suck in the Sean Hannity fans.
3- it is based in, and dependent upon, exacerbating already-prevalent anti-European xenophobia. At least the sales pitch is. Something tells me, given the way pendulums tend to swing two ways, that the post-Dubya era will be marked by a [I]rapprochement [/I] with Europe rather than still further polarization. Especially as we will be closer to broke than ever before by the time the neos are done with us and will need all the friends we can get.
I realize that there is now a cold war between OD and the Phora, but I recommend you surf on over to get Fade's detailed version of this. Wait, don't make that face! - you [I]also [/I] get to read my own deathless, deeply-skeptical prose re this and other topics (all in THE GENERAL FORUMS section) as well as AY's typically-peerless parsing of the topic.
Those of you who despise Linder & VNN get a further bonus. Not only is there no end of VNN-bashing but I myself have broken ranks with VNN and have posted a few long screeds detailing the what and why. As ever, while I cannot claim any particularly brilliant insights, I follow the Ragno Rule of English Usage, mainly [I]You have no right [B]not [/B] to entertain your reader[/I].
2004-12-14 14:34 | User Profile
[QUOTE]If I were philosophizing, I'd think it would be more appropro to quote Dick Vermeil "Its time to take off the diapers and get to work"[/QUOTE]
Good one, Okie.
How's Vermeil doing this year?
2004-12-14 14:55 | User Profile
[QUOTE=Princest]Er, no. Fade's joined a tradition that is MUCH broader than American Nazi sympathizers have ever belonged to, or ever will. Racialism was MAINSTREAM in the West before your Nazi heroes came along and stigmatized it. Fade represents a broad tendency of promoting a sensible racialist program rooted in AMERICA, within the framework of AMERICAN government, religion, and law. This is the antithesis of a "niche ideology," let alone a small one. You and your neo-Nazi ilk are the ones who belong to a discredited niche.[/QUOTE]
So let me get this right, you're painting OD and myself as 'American Nazi sympathizers'?
:lol: Sorry for laughing, but that's just hilarious.
2004-12-14 14:56 | User Profile
[QUOTE=Princest]Thanks for the laugh. FADE ALONE has more intellectual power than all the regulars at OD COMBINED.[/QUOTE]
It is sweet to see his mom out supporting him on the internet.
2004-12-14 15:18 | User Profile
The best thing to do Tex is just ignore them. They're not out to build coalitions. They just want to blowhard..."You're wrong, we're right, you fools!" Blow, blow, blow the house down and denigrate anyone who disagrees with them. Anger at the System is not tolerated on The Phora, better to just fall in line with the Preacher, or suffer from Carpal Tunnel Syndrome trying to debate minutiae with closed minded, self-righteous sycophants. It's [I]1984[/I] on The Phora and if they could get their hands on you they'd probably throw you on the Rack because you read Goldstein's book.
It's the same old story anywhere you go on internet forums, I guess. Preaching to the choir is the destiny of tyrants and ubiquitous around the world.
2004-12-14 15:31 | User Profile
[QUOTE=xmetalhead]The best thing to do Tex is just ignore them. [/QUOTE]
Sure X, that's the right approach. Just that when they come on here and then start calling you and others American hating Nazis it's hard to not say something in return. Especially when you consider the banning from here that fade evidently likes to wear on his sleeve was because he was the Nazi arguing for the extermination of jews on our pages. I guess a new month brings a new opposite, extreme ideology.
I'll proceed to go on about our usual business and let's hope everyone else does, too. Obviously they've got Raina the jewish lezbo troll and some others over there that are itching for fights, but I've really no desire to go on witch hunts amongst fellow sympathizers of the greater nationalist cause.
2004-12-14 15:46 | User Profile
[B]I guess a new month brings a new opposite, extreme ideology.[/B]
That's a pretty good definition of Fade's modus operandi.
Racial communitarianism is actually a French "New Right" idea dating back to at least the '70s and '80s and Alain de Benoist. So Fade can't even claim originality but is actually plagiarising the French whom he now scorns like a good flag-waving neo-con Freeper.
[url]http://foster.20megsfree.com/468.htm[/url]
2004-12-14 16:19 | User Profile
[QUOTE=Texas Dissident]Just that when they come on here and then start calling you and others American hating Nazis it's hard to not say something in return. Especially when you consider the banning from here that fade evidently likes to wear on his sleeve was because he was the Nazi arguing for the extermination of jews on our pages. I guess a new month brings a new opposite, extreme ideology.[/QUOTE]
Well, they can say whatever they want, I suppose, but it's only empty accusations. I've stated my case over there, and if I'm a Nazi or Nazi sympathizer, or as Fade just loves to toss out...America-hater, so be it. They're using the same smear tactics that the neocons, enemies of White Nationalism, use to wipe out any further discussions of the most important issues facing White people today. Our enemies have no such benevolence as Fade would like to believe. I'm old enough to have lived through the effects of multiculturalism and immigration and intergration. Where there was happiness and goodness and White community, I've seen the destruction of schools, neighborhoods after neighborhoods, communities, morals, quality of life, with my own eyes, transforming seemingly overnight into ugliness and decay and I'm supposed to listen to college kid Fade The Butcher in his little bubble down in Alabama tell ME that I'm bitter on America thereby deligitmitizing any views I have?? That this program of destruction, just happened out of thin air? Or it was really the Europeans that put a gun to the White man to allow Shaniqua into my shcool, neighborhood and church?? That it really was the White man all along that devised the plans to bring about his own suicide?? We're supposed to work within this current system to attain our goals?? Insane, itz.
For now, for me, it's work, family, God, and Dissent.
You see, Tex, anyone can claim the 'moral highground' by dissuading anger in favor of diligence, but the fact remains that Fade and The Phora are only internet commandos with the bigger mouths, right now, and probably, most likely, have done nothing in the real world to back up what they eagerly chant over there in their little corner of the internet. It's not their fault, however, for doing nothing but blowharding. They fail to see that the 'Kwa does not, will not, can not accept what they propose as the new shit for Whites to get high on. In their bubbly little worlds, like the Freepers, all's good in the 'Kwa. Yet, their awakening is not yet complete and America glides ever closer to the edge of the cliff where the momentum is so forceful that Racial "Communitarianism" will simply be road kill on the highway to NWO.
I'm not knocking them for trying, though, it's always good to search for new ideas or new means of achieving what you want, but for racially conscious White males, reality will eventually kill your idealism and force you to realize that there's no going [I]backwards[/I] to the Way We Whites Were. The hope, for racially conscious White males, is that the future, by God's Will, will behold a new opportunity whether by Collapse, War, or spontaneous circumstances beyond our control and by God, where then our Wisdom should lead us to establish what's right for us and for our survival.
I'd never discourage other views on the Movement or say that my views are the best, but I don't have to agree, or even like, those views espoused on The Phora either and they'd do well to use such Wisdom.
2004-12-14 16:30 | User Profile
[QUOTE]Anger at the System is not tolerated on The Phora, better to just fall in line with the Preacher, or suffer from Carpal Tunnel Syndrome trying to debate minutiae with closed minded, self-righteous sycophants. [/QUOTE]
In fairness, there is no censorship at the Phora. There [I]have [/I] been periodic seizures of censorship here. Wintermute's fate alone illustrates this.
Anger at the System [I]is [/I] tolerated in that you can post anything you want. There's plenty of debate. Fade for one lives for it. Me, I don't put 'debate' on anywhere near as high a pedestal. I've said this before, but debate is too often what discussion degenerates into. It turns ideas and points of view into a game of one-on-one scored on a point-system.
One-on-one is of limited interest. Shoot, that's what email is for.
Fade has articulated a worldview that - as we all know by now - is a complete 180 from his old views. What he doesn't seem to grasp is his previous utterances weren't simply obnoxious - it's that he liked to ram them down your throat with the same preening cocksureness that he displays today. But most people who blithely advocate genocide and drip pure hatred of America and then have a genuine change of heart display humility and contrition. It's the kind of realization - and repudiation - that should profoundly disquiet the soul. If you really experience this, and say to yourself, "My God, how could I have ever said and thought these things? They're [I]ghastly[/I]", the next question is going to inevitably be, "Who am I really? What have I become?" One would think this would be followed by at least a period of reticence. Of "I'm just going to shut up for a while, and do a lot of thinking."
I could be wrong, of course, but I see not an iota of anecdotal evidence that this ever happened with Fade. It looks a lot more like hardheaded pragmatism: "Shit, this Nazi stuff is a dead end. I'm not winning arguments, I'm being beaten. I gotta find something that'll fly. [I]I am not going to accept losing[/I]."
It's like he went to sleep Sunday night as William Pierce, and woke up Monday morning as William Kristol. Compounding this is his inability at making any persuasive argument on a human, emotional level. He might have put away the swastika, but the methodology is still cold/ruthless/efficient. It's still based on the need to look down on humanity from an aerie of privileged superiority. Ubermenschian, itz. Look at my signature for an illustration of what I'm referring to.
However, he makes many valid points and - if debate [I]is[/I] your cup of tea - he's an unquestionably skilled practitioner of the art. He's also weaned more than a few people from the Nazi-fetishist path, and you have to give him credit for that. He may be 100% genuine, but if you've seen both Fades, old and new, he doesn't have the necessary common touch required to make you believe it. Onething is undeniable, however: if you did witness the Old Fade, you will recall what a hateful bastard he was. Compared to [I]that [/I] guy, the New Fade's a day at the friggin' beach.
Now, Raina/Princest is just a puddle of runny orange diarrhea. She's Fade's second lieutenant because it gives her a perch to continue being Raina from. It's unChristian to say that [I]the day of her violent and degrading death will be like the planet Earth winning the lottery[/I]. But I'm not a Christian.
2004-12-14 16:38 | User Profile
[COLOR=DarkRed][B] - "It's unChristian to say that the day of her violent and degrading death will be like the planet Earth winning the lottery."[/B][/COLOR]
Are you so sure, Ragman?
[B][COLOR=Blue]Psalms 55:15
Let death seize upon them, and let them go down quick into hell: for wickedness is in their dwellings, and among them. [/COLOR] [/B]
Petr
2004-12-14 16:39 | User Profile
Well, [I]shet mah mouf[/I]!
2004-12-14 16:45 | User Profile
[I] - "Racial communitarianism is actually a French "New Right" idea dating back to at least the '70s and '80s and Alain de Benoist. So Fade can't even claim originality but is actually plagiarising the French whom he now scorns like a good flag-waving neo-con Freeper."[/I]
De Benoist (spit) is anti-Christian, whereas Fade (at present) is not.
Also, that interview you link to contains some rather crude factual errors from Alain:
[B] - "Today, in Europe there are 52.2 [sic] million Muslims (25 million in Russia and 13.5 in Western Europe), a majority of whom are of European stock." [/B]
Petr
2004-12-14 17:13 | User Profile
[QUOTE=il ragno]It's like he went to sleep Sunday night as William Pierce, and woke up Monday morning as William Kristol. Compounding this is his inability at making any persuasive argument on a human, emotional level. He might have put away the swastika, but the methodology is still cold/ruthless/efficient. It's still based on the need to look down on humanity from an aerie of privileged superiority. Ubermenschian, itz. Look at my signature for an illustration of what I'm referring to.[/QUOTE]
That's good insight, IR. It's one of things I couldn't quite put my finger on, but reflected in things like a tendency to refer to oneself in the third person.
Just kind of unsettling.
2004-12-14 17:13 | User Profile
[QUOTE=il ragno]I realize that there is now a cold war between OD and the Phora, but I recommend you surf on over to get Fade's detailed version of this. Wait, don't make that face! - you [I]also [/I] get to read my own deathless, deeply-skeptical prose re this and other topics (all in THE GENERAL FORUMS section) as well as AY's typically-peerless parsing of the topic. [/QUOTE]
Please post a link.
Thanks,
Walter
2004-12-14 17:20 | User Profile
[url]http://www.thephora.org/forum/showthread.php?t=5947[/url]
Begins with my break with VNN and sort of morphs into Racial Whatsitarianism.
But there are related spillovers throughout the LOUNGE, ROUND TABLE and OPPOSITION FORUMS thread.
2004-12-14 19:19 | User Profile
[QUOTE=il ragno][url]http://www.thephora.org/forum/showthread.php?t=5947[/url]
Begins with my break with VNN and sort of morphs into Racial Whatsitarianism.
But there are related spillovers throughout the LOUNGE, ROUND TABLE and OPPOSITION FORUMS thread.[/QUOTE]
I perused the thread.
[QUOTE]Nobody with a middling two-digit iq is ever going to take seriously a 'movement' made up of depraved has-beens so far beyond the pale - and more importantly, you are getting yourself in deeper and deeper with vendetta-minded losers who have nothing to offer either you or white American society except a laundry-list of scores they've been waiting two decades to settle.[/QUOTE]
I hate to say this Spiderman, but you sound like a more eloquent version of me.
Walter
2004-12-14 19:38 | User Profile
[QUOTE]It's like he went to sleep Sunday night as William Pierce, and woke up Monday morning as William Kristol. [/QUOTE]
:biggrin:
2004-12-14 20:02 | User Profile
[QUOTE]I hate to say this Spiderman, but you sound like a more eloquent version of me.[/QUOTE]
Well, here's what I posted to the VNN Forum a few hours later.
If anyone is confused, Alex and VNN have been co-opted, and subsequently hijacked, by various remnants of The Order and related hangers-on. The Order financed lunatic-fringe racial nationalists through a string of bank robberies in which innocent people were killed. All of them were eventually caught and imprisoned. Nearly all of them struck deals to inform/testify against each other. Flash forward 20 years to now. Linder has entered into a sort of working partnership with one Glenn Miller, one of those who cooperated in exchange for a lighter sentence. This has resulted in a VNN tabloid newspaper called THE ARYAN ALTERNATIVE, but it has also precipitated a hornet's nest of recriminations and threats, resulting in a kind of poverty-row hostile takeover of his forum by an anti-Miller/Linder faction, and he has been locked out of the server. For his part, Linder has pledged his loyalty to Miller and is currently seeking new cyberlodgings. In the meantime, VNN has steadily devolved into a geek pit of the kind of 'racialists' who embody every toxic caricature the media could hope for: it's all '88' and 'RAHOWA' and 'the 14 words'; one guy shouts 'we are called by YHWH to kill ZOGlings by the hundreds of milions'; another begins a thread of Jewish actresses you'd most want to rape; and so forth. The general consensus is that the people killed should not be the usual suspects (Jews, blacks, etc) but other whites insufficient to the task of racial holy war. The banner at the top of the page now reads "Now 99% rat free!". Alex Linder is not exactly popular with these people and his 'partner', Miller, is a virtual pariah.
Everybody up to speed? Okay. Surprisingly, the following drew a 50/50 reaction after it appeared. Caution: profanity. Make that justified profanity. The post is preceded by a quote from ubernut Martin Lindstedt and is a typical sampling of what VNN - particularly its forum - has become.
[QUOTE][QUOTE]Quote: [COLOR=DarkRed]The Christian Identity Revolutionary policy is simple -- kill all the whigger ZOGlings by the hundreds of millions and let YHWH sort them out. [/QUOTE]
[FONT=Book Antiqua]How? By making them smell the inside of your trailer, two at a time? Might take you a few months to get up to a hundred million that way, Madman Marty.
Hey, Alex *ed up. And ed up, and ***ed [I]up[/I]. But not by teaming up with "Traitor Glenn Miller" since he was obviously desperate and out of options by that point.
No, back before he was trying to Lead A Movement, Alex had himself a high old time by spraying hot green diarrhea on anyone he had even the remotest chance of finding common cause with who wasn't a complete social defective, from Canny Sammy to Kevin Strom and all points between. (Even Chuck Pearson got shpritzed with shit!) Nobody was hardcore enough for Alex, and if that wasn't enough, he took time out [I]every day [/I] to make sure every white Christian on Earth had an unobstructed view of him wiping his ass with their Bible. I mean, ****, there are only, what - 600 million Christians out there? Who needs em, am I right? Especially when you've got Lindstedt mowing down "Zogling whiggerputas" 100 million at a time.
So by the time he came down with the NA Flu and decided he had to be the general of an army too - because being the only writer in WN circles effective enough to reach out through cyberspace and create racialists through the power of his words wasn't good enough anymore - he'd scared off pretty much everyone of any possible use, and what was he left with?
[B]You [/B] *s. A ragtag army of leftover militia incompetents, paranoid schizophrenics and the chronically underemployed. Morons who clink steins in honor of *wits with a glorious legacy of pointless infighting, botched bank robberies and the 100-yard dash to the attorney general's office once the law inevitably followed the breadcrumb trail to the correct double-wide. The only "legacy" your Movement heroes left was robbery, murder and failure so catastrophic that ZOG clamping down even harder was legitimized in the minds of millions of white Americans [I]as a necessary measure to prevent more "Orders"[/I]. That's right - the indirect result of your David Lanes and "Pastor" Butlers was nothing less than all-out demonization of white people in the minds of other white people. RAHOWA has put more white girls on nigger laps than a month straight of MTV RAPS.
You like that? You ought to...you made it happen, and you're [I]still [/I] making it happen.
It's not like I blame you guys, though. I mean, look at you fools; if you're not sniping at Stormfront or Phora or any [I]other [/I] venue trying to get people to stop feeling ashamed of their white skin, you're at each others' throats nonstop like a pack of rabid curs, taking sides over [I]which [/I] discredited convicted felon to side with. The idea that 98% of the white folks in the Western World - whom you should be twisting yourselves into pretzels to reach out to and reclaim - rightly abhor you as mental patients-in-waiting, rocking back and forth and hugging your knees waiting for a Day of the Rope that's never coming [I]never [/I] seems to bother you. Whoever won't take a flier from one of your 'distribution clerks' will just go on the list for Lindstedt to kill, eh? You'd do far more for the image of the white race (and save a ton of printing costs besides) by just holding a belching contest instead.
I blame Alex. His policy of [I]frighten off everyone you haven't already infuriated [/I] could only end this way. And you wanna hear the kicker?
[I]Alex Linder, for all his shortsighted stupidity, is still worth more than the whole lot of you combined[/I]. Because when he wants to - when he's not trying to play Gauleiter of Cyberspace - he can write rings around 90% of the scribblers out there, ZOG or otherwise. He has a knack you can't learn in a classroom for phrasing the truth in such a way that reaches inside self-hating whites and stirs something in them they very often had no idea was there in the first place. Too bad he had to paint himself into a corner where the only people left to stand with him - until today, of course - are the absolute dregs of white nationalism, guaranteed to make the back hairs stand up on any Caucasian who doesn't move their lips when they read.
That's why I am pleading with him to walk away and stay away until the stench of what VNN has become has dissipated, and start all over again. I have read an interminable amount of chest-thumping here about how no rat should ever be allowed back in the Movement. I say that anyone who routinely brags of how long and honorably they have served in the Movement must be drummed [I]out [/I] of the Movement. You've had your turn at bat and you've failed miserably, "accomplishing" nothing but repulsing and frightening white people the world over until they're uneasy even identifying themselves as white. You could [B]not [/B] have ****ed it up any worse than you have, and you owe the white race a fresh start and a fighting chance at a future worth living in by crawling back into your holes and staying there once and for all. Then there might actually be a "Movement" that's not a despicable embarassment to the race that once produced Mozart and Da Vinci and Goethe and Shakespeare.
Of course, you won't do that because it isn't about the white race for you dysfunctional goobers and it never was. It's all about chest-thumping and perverted fantasies of genocide and mass rape and screen names like "On Your Knees Nigger Boy". Good job, assholes.
You may now resume the Glenn Miller Wars. Don't forget to call me a Jew and/or a paid ZOG agent! [/FONT] [/COLOR] [/QUOTE]
2004-12-14 20:15 | User Profile
Ragman: I got it. I mean, I read most of the thread.
The point is that if we're serious about making an impact with mainstream white America then all of that angry Nazi/skinhead/Linderite anti-Chistian stuff is a non-starter.
Do you agree with that now?
Walter
2004-12-14 21:56 | User Profile
The Nazi stuff means two things.
National Socialist theory - from which if nothing else valuable insights and lessons can be drawn, both on what can and can't be done - is absolutely valid.
Morons appropriating the symbology, costuming and sundry totems of the Third Reich is poisonous and always was.
However the past few years have seen a weird co-mingling of the two and what is troubling is not that they are interchangable but that they are now inseparable. There is an inherent and bone-deep dishonesty to this because any movement that is driven and dictated to by its lowest rung - the rabble - is already doomed. There are unquestionably thoughtful and talented and capable people who are NS but they are hostages to the lowest echelon of the 'rank and file' and they dare not voice their disgust or the mutiny would begin five seconds after they said 'stop'. Ask Edward Gibbon what happens to armies whose only notable characteristics are a complete lack of discipline, no recognized chain of command, and generals who fear their own troops more than any enemy.
I think Alex Linder is a gifted, even inspired, rhetoritician but the type of rhetoric he specializes in has a short shelf life. When you begin by going too far the shock value is going to get you immediate attention but that audience you're cultivating now expects you to go farther every time out. You can't just go [I]as [/I] far, because they've already seen that. Sure, it's likely that every Linder reader on OD kept going back for the unique flavor of his writing and the message inside the message, but just as many were returning to see Gallagher smash an even bigger melon with an even bigger sledgehammer.
And so it was inevitable that the [I]itz coming[/I]s of say, 2000, were being 'topped' by explicit calls for the wholesale murder of Jews by 2003. When he crossed that line is actually when I had my first misgivings. But don't take my word for it: ask Franco, who I PM'ed in alarm when this second phase had begun. (Frankie was none too thrilled with this development, either.)
Now here is the - there is no other word for it - sick part: within six months he had called for the murder of Jews [I]so repeatedly [/I] that it no longer bothered me. I'd gotten used to it. I was acclimated to it. VNN had [I]normalized [/I] the idea of casual mass murder. Why should I let myself off the hook - anybody can check the archives and still find me championing Alex Linder long after he'd begun doing this. And if this gutter ideology seemed to be a pan-flute calling out every depraved scumbag in Hamelin, well, that was one of those ancillary details I didn't complicate my life thinking about. I remember responding to someone here who'd pointed this out by quipping "either you commit genocide or you get genocided." The idea that [I]sooner or later, mass murder will be inevitable and so it's better to desensitize yourself now to be ready for when it begins [/I] I think had suddenly become a given with every regular reader of VNN. You could always make yourself feel better about it by pointing to Beethoven and Da Vinci and the aesthetic and moral superiority of our race. After all, we all "knew" it was hyperbole and not to be taken literally (while simultaneously 'knowing' it was unavoidable and even to be worked towards and wished for). Of course, the only thing that was [I]really [/I] unavoidable was that "kill all the whigger ZOGlings by the hundreds of millions" was the only place this sort of rhetoric could possibly lead. There was no other place to go. That this was all a lunatic fantasy doomed not to fail but to lie stillborn in its crib never seemed to occur to anyone.
So now in retrospect I have to say that - as I like to kid myself that I'm a reasonably intelligent adult, and I never balked at this stuff - there is an insidiously conformist dynamic in NS thought and theory, despite its validity on paper, that marginalizes independent thought and emphasizes a herd mentality driven by the irrationality that [I]until we murder our enemy to the last man, we are completely powerless[/I] and makes rational people who know better eventuially subservient to irrational people who know nothing and resent everyone. The extermination of all non whites - a commonly voiced objective on VNN - requires the murder of approximately four [I]billion [/I] people, give or take. Throw in the race traitors and you're up to five.
In the meantime, nothing changes in the real world except for the worse. Real-world solutions...which take time and might fail and fail and fail until an inch of [I]real, measurable [/I] progress is made....are either derided as weak and vacillating, or end up as offset-printed newspapers of swill so laughably primitive and slope-browed that you're embarassed even to be seen holding one. These defectives who announce they are the only rightful masters of the world can't even put out a damn tabloid that isn't outclassed by a third-grade weekly reader. While Jewish and leftist influence rolls on like a juggernaut, becoming institutionalized in every Western nation, metastasizing.
Because that's the only part of this psycho fantasy that's real: where we are. And this is the part that Fade, love him or loathe him, has got 100% correct: we are ruled by forces essentially alien to us because we have offered our own people no viable alternative whatsoever. Those among us who see our dilemna clearest have become addicted to fantasies of world domination. Thanks in large part to Alex Linder. Who woke a lot of us up so he could put us to sleep in a permanent dream state.
I hate to say it because he's such a good writer who once did a lot of good. He shouted what too many of us were once afraid to murmur, and he was the first white nationalist who dared to make the truth palatable by making it funny. Anybody who's ever slogged through the bog of a Revilo Oliver essay knows what I mean. But he told us the truth just to sell us a lie. And it's not even his fault. Because if you won't think for yourself even when you're spinning your wheels into oblivion, you don't deserve to rule any part of this world.
Like I said, I don't know what will work - what path will restore an America that doesn't make you sick at heart to see dying like this. Even at our lowest ebb-points in our past there was always a majesty and vitality in this most blessed of all countries that you knew would survive any and every calamity and setback and made us the jewel in the crown of nations. But at least I know, now, what can't [I]possibly [/I] work.
2004-12-14 22:18 | User Profile
[QUOTE=il ragno] However the past few years have seen a weird co-mingling of the two and what is troubling is not that they are interchangable but that they are now inseparable. There is an inherent and bone-deep dishonesty to this because any movement that is driven and dictated to by its lowest rung - the rabble - is already doomed.[/QUOTE] Good post, Il Ragno. The broader and vaguer the definition of "Nazism" the better off the Jews are. That said, I don't doubt they do participate (and have in the past) in engineering any state of affairs where any criticism of Jews is attached to a subtle swastika.
Let's apply this to the current state of affairs at the Phora; any and all criticism of Jews is attached to "Nazism" by a small group of posters there, unless such criticism actually downplays the Jewish role in our problems. Qui bono? Does this not have strategic value? Is this not expedient? This is why I think many of the posters there are Jewish.
2004-12-14 23:25 | User Profile
IR-
My understanding of your message might need some clarification. Correct me if I am off-base.
You seem to equate the misguided but perhaps well-intentioned message of the costume Nazis with Linder's supposedly misguided but essentially well-intentioned murder rhetoric. Both are characterized as wrong- but not wrong for any inherent moral flaw; they're presented as wrong (as far as I can see) due to the undeniable fact that both approaches are such a hard sell. Their failings are due to their unmarketability, not due to their untenable moral status.
I disagree with the premise. They're both dangerous, but Linder explicitly calls for unpardonable sin. There is no comparison between the two, although both approaches are wrong and ridiculous to varying degrees. One is essentially ridiculous, while the other is base evil.
Support for Linder's call to genocide is excused by a sort of devil made me do it rationalization; Linder's novel approach via humor and talents as a writer are given as reasons to support his murder rhetoric. The real reason this person has had some resonance, I think, is that his appeal reaches out to those with similarly bleak outlooks on the meaning of life. More to the point, I think Alex Linder writes like a man with no family and no prospect of having a family (and by family I mean the broadest Christian definition of family). And I think that even those who are not in his dark circumstances can sometimes fail to resist his dark appeal. I see no reason not to read Linder's sheet; he sometimes links to some useful information. But to subscribe at any point and for any reason to his overall view of life and the solutions to our ills is to indulge the most evil temptations facing both the weak and the strong.
There is no excuse via retrospection. There is only renunciation.
Remember: *...we are ruled by forces essentially alien to us because we have offered our own people no viable alternative whatsoever. *
We have an alternative, and we are ruled by a force that is an essential part of our being. We should recognize that, and renounce all forces of evil whether they are couched in National Socialism, in neoconservative Christian Zionism, or in pharisaical Judaism. God be with us all.
2004-12-14 23:36 | User Profile
This is one of the few times that I am glad not to have a formal education, reading what you guys are talking about drives up the wall,,,,,I would be going around and around with you guys,,,,,,,, calm down Ponce go back to your cave.
2004-12-15 06:48 | User Profile
[QUOTE=weisbrot]IR-
My understanding of your message might need some clarification. Correct me if I am off-base.
You seem to equate the misguided but perhaps well-intentioned message of the costume Nazis with Linder's supposedly misguided but essentially well-intentioned murder rhetoric. Both are characterized as wrong- but not wrong for any inherent moral flaw; they're presented as wrong (as far as I can see) due to the undeniable fact that both approaches are such a hard sell. Their failings are due to their unmarketability, not due to their untenable moral status.
I disagree with the premise. They're both dangerous, but Linder explicitly calls for unpardonable sin. There is no comparison between the two, although both approaches are wrong and ridiculous to varying degrees. One is essentially ridiculous, while the other is base evil.
Support for Linder's call to genocide is excused by a sort of devil made me do it rationalization; Linder's novel approach via humor and talents as a writer are given as reasons to support his murder rhetoric. The real reason this person has had some resonance, I think, is that his appeal reaches out to those with similarly bleak outlooks on the meaning of life. More to the point, I think Alex Linder writes like a man with no family and no prospect of having a family (and by family I mean the broadest Christian definition of family). And I think that even those who are not in his dark circumstances can sometimes fail to resist his dark appeal. I see no reason not to read Linder's sheet; he sometimes links to some useful information. But to subscribe at any point and for any reason to his overall view of life and the solutions to our ills is to indulge the most evil temptations facing both the weak and the strong.
There is no excuse via retrospection. There is only renunciation.
Remember: *...we are ruled by forces essentially alien to us because we have offered our own people no viable alternative whatsoever. *
We have an alternative, and we are ruled by a force that is an essential part of our being. We should recognize that, and renounce all forces of evil whether they are couched in National Socialism, in neoconservative Christian Zionism, or in pharisaical Judaism. God be with us all.[/QUOTE]
That's the best thing I've read in a long, long time. Bravo, Weisbrot.
Il Ragno: I agree with Weisbrot that the "marketing" problem isn't the real reason we should reject Nazism, but it is nevertheless a fatal problem with the entire Nazi/Pagan/Skinhead/Linderite approach. I concentrated on this aspect of the issue inasmuch as you don't share the Holy Faith with guys like Weisbrot (and most of the rest of us) I always felt it was potential common ground. We seem to have agreed on this point, at least.
As to the larger question of what will work, you know my answer to that: the Faith of our Fathers cleansed of its many popular neo-Marxist accretions.
2004-12-15 07:24 | User Profile
Walter & Weisbrot:
You'll have to excuse me. I've written an inordinate amount of text on this subject over the last 2 days or so and I'm frankly [I]exhausted[/I]. So cutting/pasting myself will have to suffice for the moment. But how anybody can have read the excerpt below and think my concerns relate purely to [I]marketing[/I] is either a speed-reader wayyy past the speed limit or, I dunno, someone who requires a belaboring of the obvious I'm not capable of.
[B]Now here is the - there is no other word for it - sick part: within six months he had called for the murder of Jews so repeatedly that it no longer bothered me. I'd gotten used to it. I was acclimated to it. VNN had normalized the idea of casual mass murder. Why should I let myself off the hook - anybody can check the archives and still find me championing Alex Linder long after he'd begun doing this. And if this gutter ideology seemed to be a pan-flute calling out every depraved scumbag in Hamelin, well, that was one of those ancillary details I didn't complicate my life thinking about. [/B]
Walter:
[QUOTE]As to the larger question of what will work, you know my answer to that: the Faith of our Fathers cleansed of its many popular neo-Marxist accretions.[/QUOTE]
You are on record, not once but several times, calling for mass murder yourself, fondly invoking Christian soldiers dashing the heads of their enemies' infant children on rocks, and don't give me any of that 'metaphor' horseshit either. It is your most fervent desire a religious revival occur in the West [I]as a necessary precedent for a real live Holy War[/I]; failing this result, you've spoken [I]often [/I] of that hideout in the woods you plan to sit out the [I]exact [/I] sort of bloodbath that every Hollywood Nazi and RAHOWAite bases their rhetoric and philosophy upon.
Same belief, same adherence to catastrophic bloodshed and utter chaos as a thing to be devoutly wished for, different ulterior motive. The idea that you might have [I]any [/I] moral high ground to point fingers at the Itz Comingites from is [I]laughable [/I] - and if the self-styled Nazis must be resisted and repudiated, so must the Armagedonnites sitting comfortably in the bleacher seats, flagging down the peanut vendor while waiting for the Murder Show to get underway.
2004-12-15 08:21 | User Profile
[I][B]"The idea that you might have any moral high ground to point fingers at the Itz Comingites from is laughable ..."[/B][/I]
Well, we could always say that "Itz Comingites" are [I]cheap imitations [/I] whereas we are the [B]real deal[/B].
:lol:
Seriously, you seem to have a slight paranoia going on with militant Christians.
Petr
2004-12-15 08:41 | User Profile
[QUOTE]You are on record, not once but several times, calling for mass murder yourself, fondly invoking Christian soldiers dashing the heads of their enemies' infant children on rocks, and don't give me any of that 'metaphor' horseshit either. It is your most fervent desire a religious revival occur in the West as a necessary precedent for a real live Holy War; failing this result, you've spoken often of that hideout in the woods you plan to sit out the exact sort of bloodbath that every Hollywood Nazi and RAHOWAite bases their rhetoric and philosophy upon. [/QUOTE]
No way, I'm not calling for mass murder. I have said repeatedly that bloody war appears to me to be unavoidable, and that a different moral code applies in times of war. But blaming me for that is like blaming Newton and his theory of gravity for airplane crashes. I'm just guessing the future as best I can and taking appropriate actions to first protect me and mine from the effects and second steering events as best I can (if such is indeed possible at all).
As Sir Arthur Keith points out, there are two moral codes: the code of amity and the code of enmity. The rules governing civil relations within nations differ utterly from those governing peoples at war as revealed both by the Natural Law. The Natural Law, standing alone, no doubt allows genocide. But while the general contours of the Natural Law are reflected in Scripture, Tradition and the teachngs of the Catholic Church, these same revealed sources serve to limit Natural morality.
To wit: there exist some broad rules of war that must be observed, but the Bible itself sanctions very harsh measures of the Natural Law. My point is that if we have to go to war, then so be it, and we play by the rules so established by Nature and Nature's God. We are free - even commanded - to slaughter our fellow human beings in war. We are free to lie to them, to decieve them, and to take their property. There are limits in regard to reasonable measures to prevent civilian casualties and so forth, but they're pretty damned broad. To say otherwise is to adopt an indefensibly pollyannish position.
My disagreement with you seems to arise from your failure to recognize the Christian influence in your moral assumptions. On the one hand you praise the Nazis for - whatever - yet on the other hand you would condemn Christians for applying much more disciplined versions of the same measures.
As I've written previously, the difference between Christains and the Nazis in regard to morality is that the Nazis believed only in the Natural Law, which clearly condones their very beastial measures. Survival of the most ruthless, as it were. That does seem to be Evolution's law, after all.
In contrast, we Christians believe in both the Natural Law and Revelation. We are threfore constrained not only by the very broad limits of the Natural Law, but also by the dictates of Scripture (and in my case the Magisterium of the Catholic Church). Revelation narrows the Natural Law limits of moral behaviour, especially in the context of war.
The Nazis weren't Christians, and so they logically enough did not subject themselves to these revealed limitations, and therefore undertook freely the most beastial - and throughly natural - measures. In so doing they were consistent in the application of their moral postulates. And I really have no argument with them on that point. The whole thing boils down to whether man is merely natural, or whether indeed there is a transcendent God who stands above and outside of Nature, and who establishes a law higher than the merely natural. I say there is, the Nazis - good pagans that they were - said there isn't. It's a fundamental, yet completely honest, disagreement.
To repeat, my beef with you is your failure to recognize the very Christian influences in your own moralizing. We seem to agree that war is horrible but is subject to limits, including especially a total ban on genocide. But why exactly do you think that? Where did you ever get such a notion? From your observations of nature? I think not.
Let me put it to you, then, why is mass murder of civilians in time of war immoral? Please give me good reasons for that drawn from your own non-Christian moral postulates. I'll bet you can't do it. My impression is that you simply "feel" that mass murder of innocents, including the slaughter Jews by the Nazis, is wrong. I totally agree with you on that. My point is that the only reason you "feel" that way is due to the Christian cultural influences you fail to acknowledge.
I'm only asking you to get honest about that.
Walter
2004-12-15 08:42 | User Profile
Mass murder is mass murder. Exhorting the susceptible and the gullible of the need to commit it - in the name of anything - is antithetical to civilization.
I'm not talking about war - I'm talking about [I]holy war[/I]. The kind where everyone [I]begins [/I] propagandized/indoctrinated/fully intending to kill all the men, all of the women and all of the children.
Walter has [I]also [/I] discussed the need to keep this sort of thing among the elect and not to frighten the flock away by explicitly telling them what you are pointing them towards.
If this is what your God asks of you, then stop complaining about affirmative action and public Nativity displays and gay marriage and [I]just say so, out loud[/I].
2004-12-15 08:53 | User Profile
[QUOTE=il ragno]Mass murder is mass murder. Exhorting the susceptible and the gullible of the need to commit it - in the name of anything - is antithetical to civilization.
I'm not talking about war - I'm talking about [I]holy war[/I]. The kind where everyone [I]begins [/I] propagandized/indoctrinated/fully intending to kill all the men, all of the women and all of the children.
Walter has [I]also [/I] discussed the need to keep this sort of thing among the elect and not to frighten the flock away by explicitly telling them what you are pointing them towards.
If this is what your God asks of you, then stop complaining about affirmative action and public Nativity displays and gay marriage and [I]just say so, out loud[/I].[/QUOTE]
You utterly failed to address the question. I'll ask again. What are your moral postulates?
You say:
[QUOTE]Mass murder is mass murder [/QUOTE] That is a a vacuous tautology. But why is mass murder wrong? Why is the mass murder of enemies "antithetical to civilization?" You continue to duck this question.
And whose "civilization" are you talking about? Pagan Roman? Spartan Greece? Nazi civilization (and the Third Reich was a great civilization)???? All of those civilizations engaged in unspeakable horrors, including the enslavement of entire populations, genocide (the Romans killed every last Carthaginian), and mass terror (the Romans used public CRUCIFIXTION as the preferred means of mass terror of occupied peoples).
You're exhibiting intellectual cowardice here. You blithely assume deeply Christian moral positions, take them as givens too obvious for discussion, and then turn around and use those same moral achievements - won by the blood of the Martyrs and the quiet work of 2,000 years of Christian men and women - as a bludgeon against Christianity!
Look at your own assumptions, identify them clearly, tell me where they came from, and then draw conclusions from them.
But enough of your assuming some wimpy altar boy morality even as you stand in judgement of the altar.
Get honest.
W
2004-12-15 10:31 | User Profile
Congratulations, Walter.
Your logic, inevitably and inexorably, will drive people into the arms of the Nazis you loathe so much.
If Linder were as canny as he was loud, he'd post your Christian Taliban material - and beauties like the response above - right on the spintro page, pointing out that National Socialism and Christianity are no more than two squads in the same intramural league. And the Nazis are snappier dressers.
How is it that a purportedly intelligent man cannot see that this is so? Because after he's pushed his supper plate away from him, kissed his wife and kids goodnight and put the cat out, he can log on to the Internet and plunge back into his favorite role-playing fantasy game: Yannis the Crusader.
I suggest that, instead, you get dressed, start the car, go driving through the night until you encounter a transient or a wino who won't be missed [I]or [/I] mourned, and kill him. Just to watch him die, and to practice repressing any shame or revulsion you might feel - kill the weenie altar boy within who will [I]have [/I] to be done away with anyway, for you to participate in the glorious Day of God's Rope. You can consider it kinda like [I]spring training[/I].
Good night.
2004-12-15 11:04 | User Profile
[QUOTE=il ragno]Congratulations, Walter.
Your logic, inevitably and inexorably, will drive people into the arms of the Nazis you loathe so much.
If Linder were as canny as he was loud, he'd post your Christian Taliban material - and beauties like the response above - right on the spintro page, pointing out that National Socialism and Christianity are no more than two squads in the same intramural league. And the Nazis are snappier dressers.
How is it that a purportedly intelligent man cannot see that this is so? Because after he's pushed his supper plate away from him, kissed his wife and kids goodnight and put the cat out, he can log on to the Internet and plunge back into his favorite role-playing fantasy game: Yannis the Crusader.
I suggest that, instead, you get dressed, start the car, go driving through the night until you encounter a transient or a wino who won't be missed [I]or [/I] mourned, and kill him. Just to watch him die, and to practice repressing any shame or revulsion you might feel - kill the weenie altar boy within who will [I]have [/I] to be done away with anyway, for you to participate in the glorious Day of God's Rope. You can consider it kinda like [I]spring training[/I].
Good night.[/QUOTE]
You still AVOID THE QUESTION.
In fact, you do so by deprecating LOGIC ITSELF.
I've said it before and I'll say it again: talking with you is like trying to reason with a chick.
Man.
I'll ask you again: please identify your moral postulates, define their source, and lead me through a syllogistic chain to your moral conclusion that mass murder is wrong.
Hey, Ragman, it's only fair. I've always made it a point to address your questions. Now kindly address mine.
Walter
2004-12-15 12:03 | User Profile
[QUOTE=Walter Yannis]I've said it before and I'll say it again: talking with you is like trying to reason with a chick.[/QUOTE]Funny you should mention that: there's speculation at The Phora that il ragno may be a chick, specifically a fat and cranky one.
2004-12-15 12:12 | User Profile
[QUOTE=Princest]Funny you should mention that: there's speculation at The Phora that il ragno may be a chick, specifically a fat and cranky one.[/QUOTE]
Piss off, troll.
2004-12-15 12:43 | User Profile
Yeah. Lot of "speculation", ie, Raina.
Walter:
I'm not ducking or misreading your dishonest question. You want me to say "from the mouth of Our Lord and Saviour Jesus Christ", so that [I]you [/I] can draw a line from Jesus through the Catholic Church to the Crusades and shout "Huzzah! It ain't killing if you're killing on the direct orders of the Prince of Peace! Join with us - c'mon, I'll save you a nice heathen baby to trample!"
You're trying to logic me onto The Team with your patented My God Is A Fierce God, Not Some Friggin' Flower-Smelling Pansy Who Crosses His Legs Like A Girl sales pitch. I [I]get [/I] it, okay? I picked up on this last year when you began your disastrous Christian Taliban project that emptied this place out faster than greased lightning.
[I]Jesus[/I], Walter (yes, I recognize the irony so don't point it out) - how many times do you want to kill OD? Two? Three? [I]Ten[/I]?
You and your 'syllogistic tautologies' - you can prove mathematically that yours is the only Hard and Verifiable Truth, but for some reason you can't find anyone who'll sit still long enough for you to harangue them wth it.
There isn't one of you Jezoo Talibannies who'll take 'no' for an answer, or accept the notion that Supermen In The Sky who no one has ever seen do not constitute 'proof' of anything except your own beliefs and worldview.
So suppose I instead say, "from the mouth of Jesus of Nazareth, a renegade Jewish philosopher whose teachings have been twisted and perverted for 2000 years by the whores and serpents of Christendom"? Yeah. I think I like that better.
Seriously, it's like me asking you to throw out any tape recorders you ,may own or swear allegiance to Nazi Germany under whose auspiuces magnetic tape was first developed.
2004-12-15 13:38 | User Profile
[QUOTE=Walter Yannis]Piss off, troll.[/QUOTE]Damn, you really are an idiot! Go ahead, just try to alienate every possible ally you could ever have. With your attitude, no wonder OD makes any graveyard look like a Saturday night dance club. Perhaps that has been your goal all along, Mr. I-Can't-Make-Up-My-Mind-Whether-I'm-Cromwell-Or-Torquemada.
Moron.
2004-12-15 13:45 | User Profile
For pity's sakes, Tex, please re-ban Raina. She seems to have shifted her vendetta-focus from AY to me, and we all know what will soon follow. Keep an eye out for multiple "new registrations", too.
Had I known she'd begin stalking me like this, I wouldn't have returned. My apologies to all here.
2004-12-15 16:48 | User Profile
Hahahahahaha you guys are fun to watch, glad to see that you are having fun.
2004-12-15 17:12 | User Profile
....meanwhile, a band of wretched liars and their idolaters continue to steer the USA towards the cliff at astonishing speeds. If the USA goes over the precipice, so do Pagan and Christian alike.....
2004-12-15 18:31 | User Profile
Because of recent developments and all the growing cyber-turmoil in and around the websites most frequented by the greater nationalist concerned citizenry, I wanted to open things up here for our people who have once called OD home. For those that lurk but have not participated, I would invite you to join-in now, too.
Mistakes have been made by me, no doubt. But the times demand that we pull this thing together or we may never again have the chance. I envision a working political/cultural coalition that encompasses folks from Stormfront to the American Conservative. My recent overture to those ODers that have left for whatever reason to come back is integral to that vision. We're small and don't amount to much in the greater scheme of things, but it's the least I can do.
Further, I'm going to do my best not to target my fellow nationalists for criticism or attacks over presentations and appearances, etc. Hopefully they will return the favor. It's no secret what my beliefs are and my wishes for this board. Despite the shrill comments of some likely jewish trolls, I don't think OD is a nazi board. I think we are pretty much a plain vanilla traditional conservative board that has active members from a broad ideological spectrum.
There are some trolls and foreign interests who don't want to see any of us getting along. Things may be a bit rough here over the next few weeks or so, depending on how much disruption they want to cause. I won't shut this board down because of them, but whenever I see that it is a troll posting, please be sure they will be terminated with extreme prejudice. Known disruptive trolls will not be openly allowed to spew their vomit here on our pages.
Anyway, just some thoughts. Sorry it's so sloppy and stated so badly. Eloquence is not my strong suit.
Everyone please get active and thanks for caring enough to show up here.
2004-12-15 21:50 | User Profile
[QUOTE]As Sir Arthur Keith points out, there are two moral codes: the code of amity and the code of enmity. The rules governing civil relations within nations differ utterly from those governing peoples at war as revealed both by the Natural Law. The Natural Law, standing alone, no doubt allows genocide. But while the general contours of the Natural Law are reflected in Scripture, Tradition and the teachngs of the Catholic Church, these same revealed sources serve to limit Natural morality.
To wit: there exist some broad rules of war that must be observed, but the Bible itself sanctions very harsh measures of the Natural Law. My point is that if we have to go to war, then so be it, and we play by the rules so established by Nature and Nature's God. We are free - even commanded - to slaughter our fellow human beings in war. We are free to lie to them, to decieve them, and to take their property. There are limits in regard to reasonable measures to prevent civilian casualties and so forth, but they're pretty damned broad. To say otherwise is to adopt an indefensibly pollyannish position.
My disagreement with you seems to arise from your failure to recognize the Christian influence in your moral assumptions. [/QUOTE] I suppose I shouldn't be surprised that you brought up this point, but I am most grateful. I really wasn't sure how to broach the subject, but in strictest terms there is nothing [I]immoral[/I] about the mass murder under discussion. In defining us out of their moral community, the Jews defined themselves out of ours. The classic "Big Lie" is that Jews treat us as members of their moral community (i.e., that we are part of the same "organism"), inducing us to extend to Jews the same rights as we extend to one another while they fail to extend the protections of their ingroup morality to us.
A moral system is in essence a set of reciprocal rights and responsibilities, contractual in nature. Within the moral community, individuals are not in a Hobbesian "state of nature"; between moral communities, however, in the absence of [I]enforceable[/I] agreement (treaty), such a state of nature exists. As is reflected in Deuteronomy as well as other historical and presentday actions of the Jewish community, no mutual anti-genocide treaty is in effect. A revulsion at the suggestion of mass murder must be based on emotion, esthetics, or ... religion.
2004-12-16 03:11 | User Profile
[QUOTE=mwdallas]I suppose I shouldn't be surprised that you brought up this point, but I am most grateful. I really wasn't sure how to broach the subject, but in strictest terms there is nothing [I]immoral[/I] about the mass murder under discussion. In defining us out of their moral community, the Jews defined themselves out of ours. The classic "Big Lie" is that Jews treat us as members of their moral community (i.e., that we are part of the same "organism"), inducing us to extend to Jews the same rights as we extend to one another while they fail to extend the protections of their ingroup morality to us.
A moral system is in essence a set of reciprocal rights and responsibilities, contractual in nature. Within the moral community, individuals are not in a Hobbesian "state of nature"; between moral communities, however, in the absence of [I]enforceable[/I] agreement (treaty), such a state of nature exists. As is reflected in Deuteronomy as well as other historical and presentday actions of the Jewish community, no mutual anti-genocide treaty is in effect. A revulsion at the suggestion of mass murder must be based on emotion, esthetics, or ... religion.[/QUOTE]
We see eye to eye on that one, MW.
There really is no doubt that the Natural Law, standing alone, allows for genocide in certain circumstances. As E. WO. Wilson and others point out, "blood lust" is a mental subroutine that we all inherited and that is inevitably triggered under the right circumstances. Moral strictures against genocide under the right circumstances at least is a conditioned response made possible through religious faith and cultural evolution, it isn't something we would find etched in our mamalian brains. The desire to minimize the chances of triggering our innate blood lust response is the very basis of nationalism.
We all need to recognize that, but most especially my non-Christian friends like Il Ragno. If we hold our concern for the weak and fallen - even of our tribal enemies - one of the great moral achievements of civilization, then we'd better stop attacking the religious roots of that achievement, Christianity.
Walter
2004-12-16 03:13 | User Profile
[QUOTE=Princest]Damn, you really are an idiot! Go ahead,[B] just try to alienate every possible ally you could ever have. [/B] With your attitude, no wonder OD makes any graveyard look like a Saturday night dance club. Perhaps that has been your goal all along, Mr. I-Can't-Make-Up-My-Mind-Whether-I'm-Cromwell-Or-Torquemada.
Moron.[/QUOTE]
As if I need your bony troll ass as an ally.
Piss off.
2004-12-16 03:44 | User Profile
My new post on the Phora!
OriginalDissent.com owned by... [url]http://www.thephora.org/forum/showthread.php?p=52214#post52214[/url]
2004-12-16 03:54 | User Profile
[QUOTE=Faust]My new post on the Phora!
OriginalDissent.com owned by... [url]http://www.thephora.org/forum/showthread.php?p=52214#post52214[/url][/QUOTE]
I saw that. I had no idea... :biggrin:
2005-01-31 01:36 | User Profile
[QUOTE=il ragno]Heads-up, boys: Raina's back. ("Princest")[/QUOTE]
I doubt it. Raina isn't a racialist.
[quote=il ragno]It's like he went to sleep Sunday night as William Pierce, and woke up Monday morning as William Kristol.
More like went to sleep as Hitler and woke up as FDR.
Now that The Phora's back, see you all later.
2005-01-31 04:15 | User Profile
[I]Now that The Phora's back, see you all later.[/I]
Fade cultivates a very specific fan base. Kinda like "Nuclear Thoughts", Anarch feels compelled to pirouette into the air shouting "Huzzah!" at the thought of being able to touch the hem of his hero's garment.
I'm actually tired of this dreary subject. Of course, as The Grand Re-Opening was today ("prices doubled - to punish you for not buying before!") and the feeding frenzy on me is going like gangbusters - it's always easier when your target is prevented from hitting you back - you can't blame me for being a [I]little [/I] feisty.
But I believe in beating the rush; and, as the Phora will be narcoleptic in three days or so, when the Fade Davidians slowly realize that it's back to humorless cut-and-paste lectures on Wilsonian democracy and the burning need to support Our Conservative President's Mideast initiatives, along with the usual dozen [I]boobs or butts? [/I] polls, only with harsh lesbian hall monitors spot-checking the membership for their loyalty certificates, I'm going to stop caring about all this [I]now,[/I] before the exit doors get clogged.
2005-01-31 12:45 | User Profile
[QUOTE=Anarch]*Now that The Phora's back, see you all later. * I noticed this, as well, and was mightily tempted to make a snide remark, but I figured if I just waited a couple days, all the folks who came here just looking for a place to bitch and moan about the Phora would clear out. Why stay here reminiscing about the Phoran soap opera when they could be living it?