← Autodidact Archive · Original Dissent · Happy Hacker
Thread ID: 11370 | Posts: 13 | Started: 2003-12-05
2003-12-05 15:40 | User Profile
I am friends with a family with several children. Recently the mother went to the drug store to pick up some medicine for a sick child. It was a dark, rainy, and freezing evening. She parked near the door of a drug store, next to an occupied sheriff's car. She saw he was an officer. She considered the weather. It was a somewhat upscale part of town. And, she decided to leave her children in the car, all buckled in safety seats, while she ran in. She locked the doors and took the keys with her.
She came out less than two minutes later and found the officer calling in. Now, she is getting visited at home by the Division of Family Services.
This is one of those things that make me so steaming mad.
This wasn't some frivolous stop where she carelessly left the engine running in a bad section of town while she ran in to a convenience store to get a cup of coffee. It would not have been easy for her to screw around to get all those children into the drug store, even in the best of circumstances. But, in modern America, a woman isn't suppose to have several very young children.
Anyway, her reward for being a good mother is being treated as a child abuse suspect.
2003-12-07 08:36 | User Profile
Concerning and related to the above post.. Give a listen to Clay Douglas on the Nov.28 show archived at [url]www.freeamerican.com[/url] He interviews Edgar Steel..
2003-12-08 09:43 | User Profile
Check out Edgar Steele's website [URL= ]www.conspiracypenpal.com[/URL] Mr. Steele is one of the better WN / Constitutionalists in the nation these days.
2003-12-08 14:56 | User Profile
This is the usual "excuse MY behaviour, but everyone else is bad!" idiocy! EVERY SINGLE mother and father who has EVER had their car stolen, their kids stolen, and so on has ALWAYS said "oh, it was raining and I was JUST running in to get cough syrup!"
Do you REALLY think because this mother is upper middle class and (supposedly) educated, that HER children are more safe from predators than some poor stupid woman's who was just running in for ciggies? Do you REALLY think predators are MORE Likely to steal some woman's Yugo than this wonman's fancy car?
I DON'T agree with the state getting involved with trying to "manage" parents' stupdity -- and this WAS stupidity! PLEASE don't say "well, MY friend's are different! Accidents and assaults NEVER happen to her!" Why didn't she ASK the cop to watch the car and kids while she ran in? Why didn't she get some friend or her husband (who was where?) to go with her to get the kid's medicine? Why didn't she find a pharmacy with a drive-through?
What she did was UNSAFE and just plain dumb! I'm always annoyed at people who think THEY are immune to reality! Wanna bet SHE shakes her head and disapproves with horror when those ghetto moms who leave THEIR kids alone in their cars?! But SHE'S different?!
grumble grumble ...
2003-12-08 15:22 | User Profile
I'll provisionally agree with the Rockslide of Reason here, assuming that the oldest child in the car was younger than twelve or so.
With toddlers, parents have to assume the worst. Paranoia is the greater good in almost any case, at least with normally (or abnormally, as with our situation) active kids. That three minute dash into the drugstore can turn into fifteen quickly enough, and anything can happen in thirty seconds. I would sympathize with the mother's situation, and think that the state visits to the home are overkill. But what she did was basically lazy,done for the sake of convenience. Going out in bad weather with several kids requires the logistics and planning of a military operation; it doesn't do any good to bemoan the trouble or try to rush.
2003-12-08 19:31 | User Profile
[QUOTE=Avalanche]This is the usual "excuse MY behaviour, but everyone else is bad!" idiocy! EVERY SINGLE mother and father who has EVER had their car stolen, their kids stolen, and so on has ALWAYS said "oh, it was raining and I was JUST running in to get cough syrup!" [/QUOTE]
Avalanche, that is nonsense.
Yes, people who screw up and harm their children almost always have excuses. Sometimes those excuses are true and reasonable. In this case, no one was harmed nor was there any reasonable expectation of harm. Of course, many crusaders know nothing of the word "reasonable."
Do you ever pay attention to those stories of kids getting stolen or killed after they were left in a car? Do any of them involve a locked car left unattended for two minutes? I doubt it. How many kids are stolen from cars? More likely the car is stolen because mommy left the door unlocked and the engine running in front of a 7-11 where some punks are hanging out, the kid is just baggage. Or, the kid dies because he was left there all day in the hot summer sun.
The woman in question is very responsible and over-protective. In fact, the only reason she got in trouble was because she thought she was being extra careful by parking next to an occupied police car. I recognize that as stupid. But, soccer moms trust the police. Hopefully she has learned something.
In many parts of the country, a first grader is expected to walk up to a mile to and from school (no buss service for kids in walking distance), day after day. Our society has decided is safe enough. But, leave the same first grader in a comfortable, secure car for two minutes "OH NO! YOU CAN'T DO THAT. A CAR IS NOT A TOY OR A BABY SITTER."
Anyway, as infuriating as it is to be punished for a reasonable, harmless action that is on one else's business, what really made me angry was the DFS home invasion that followed. If it's a crime, just write the ticket.
Children Left Unattended in Vehicles
Background How big is the problem? In 1999 alone, at least 27 children died of hyperthermia (heat stroke) from being locked in the passenger compartment of a vehicle.
Yeah, like on a freezing, wet evening, a kid is going to have a heat stroke from two minuts in the car. ****ing NAZI dogooders.
The Missouri boy... was dragged to his death by a suspected carjacker. "My son was just flying everywhere and I kept screaming for him to stop because my son was stuck but he wouldn't stop he just kept going," his mother recalls. His mother Christy left him in the car with the keys inside while she stepped away to buy a drink. Now, she lives with an unimaginable guilt. "I blame myself for being negligent," she says. "I didn't even think that that was going to be the worst mistake of my life."
Avalanche, are you getting some perspective?
[IMG]http://www.courttv.com/graphics/photos/trials/taped/davis/davis%5finside%5f032003.jpg[/IMG]
Here's the carjacker who dragged to death the Missouri boy. The woman I know parked next to a cop, not next to that.
With a little care, there is nothing especially dangerous about leaving a child in car for a couple of minutes. People do this thousands of times every day and when they do it with care nothing bad happens. It is only an idiot who cannot appreciate low odds of harm or aggravating circumstances that increase the odds of harm.
2003-12-08 20:10 | User Profile
[QUOTE=weisbrot]But what she did was basically lazy,done for the sake of convenience. Going out in bad weather with several kids requires the logistics and planning of a military operation; it doesn't do any good to bemoan the trouble or try to rush.[/QUOTE]
She wasn't lazy. And, so what if she were. Laziness is none of the government's business.
Given several young children, she really didn't have the ability to control them. But, I guess if she got them all out of the car and one ran into the street and was smashed by a car, she could have comforted herself knowing she did the better thing than keep them in their car seats, in a locked car, in a low-crime area, next to a cop for two minutes. And, she would have avoided DFS.
Do you think those stupid "zero tolerance" rules schools have? If a kid is kicked out for a keychain ("all chains are weapons"), would you bemoan the danger of kids with weapons?
2003-12-08 20:39 | User Profile
[QUOTE=Happy Hacker]She wasn't lazy. And, so what if she were. Laziness is none of the government's business.
Agreed- laziness is none of the government's business. However, it's my opinion that had one or more of the children come to harm- admittedly a long shot- the woman would have rightly been held liable for neglect. This would be a valid form of government business. And she was almost by definition lazy, since she took the convenient option with regard to ensuring her children's safety. Still, reporting her for "abuse" and requiring follow-up visits is stupid. It would seem that assuming a reasonable, non- jungloid manner she should have received a warning at most.
Given several young children, she really didn't have the ability to control them. But, I guess if she got them all out of the car and one ran into the street and was smashed by a car, she could have comforted herself knowing she did the better thing than keep them in their car seats, in a locked car, in a low-crime area, next to a cop for two minutes.
If that is the case, she could have considered any of the many possible alternatives to either letting her uncontrollable kids run in the streets or leaving them unwatched in the car. In any reasonably upscale neighborhood in the country there are plenty of drive-thru pharmacies, for instance.
I'm guessing you might not have kids yet. At least in my experience, the process isn't exact. Chaos and anarchy is the rule, at least until they've passed toddlerhood. Anyone with several young kids should be prepared and have the means to control those kids when confronted with a need to take them out, emergency or not. These things such as backpacks, strollers and even leashes are readily available. We've used them all when it's been required, and there is really no excuse not to take adequate (read: massive) steps to be prepared. Being responsible for young kids doesn't require paranoia, but it does require one to expect the very least expected thing to happen. The inner cities are full of the results of a casual approach to parenting- although your friend's situation sounds more like the result of a momentary lapse due to being rushed and unprepared.
Do you think those stupid "zero tolerance" rules schools have? If a kid is kicked out for a keychain ("all chains are weapons"), would you bemoan the danger of kids with weapons?[/QUOTE]
Not sure I follow you here.
2003-12-09 00:46 | User Profile
I don't think HH's friend really did anything wrong. I mean, come on -- children are probably in less danger when left alone in a parked car than as passengers in a car that's actually being driven down the highway by a parent. But a certain pig needed his daily power-trip or was just plain bored, so in went the call.
This brings another story to mind -- one in which a real crime of negligence was committed. It was maybe two years ago or thereabouts that I heard a news story about a Secret Service officer who had left a loaded .357 Sig handgun within reach of his young child. The child had shot himself in the stomach with it and died. To my knowledge, the dumbass officer was not charged with any crime. Why not? Because he's a member of the System, and the System takes care of its own. If someone outside of the law enforcement "brotherhood" had been so negligent, then you can bet your ass he would have been charged with something. And this is just one of countless examples where cops are held to a much, MUCH easier standard than the rest of us.
So, whether the issue is the care of one's children or anything else, the thing to remember is that the Almighty State does not have to live up to the same standards it imposes on the general public. That's just one reason why I despise 99% of cops and politicians and don't recognize their authority as legitimate.
2003-12-09 00:48 | User Profile
What's the use of bitching about a cop not making an exception for a white mother? He's not taught to discriminate. Going against the rules hoping for a friendly cop is a mistake.
2003-12-09 01:48 | User Profile
I think that the cop was on an ego trip. It's obvious that he observed the time it took the woman go into the store and leave. He could have just given her a warning and a lecture instead of sending CPS's to her house. Now, if she was gone for what he deemed as too long, then he should have checked to see if something had happened to her in the store, or if she was just in there playing the lotto machine and then he could call someone to investigate the family. I wonder if the cop was black and being in an afluent (white) section, he thought that he would get a feather in his cap by calling the services on the "negligent, abusive" white mother.
2003-12-09 03:48 | User Profile
Oregon has had too many case's like this in the last 20 years.. Read this and try not to weep.. I sent Edgar Steel money on this case and urged others to help back then.. HOOEY WEIRD CA. would never do a movie for these white folks, and no tears and violin's from Gefilda fish N.P.R. [url]http://oregonfamilyrights.com/christines/[/url]
2003-12-25 11:41 | User Profile
[url]http://www.vdare.com/roberts/injustices.htm[/url] Here is more evidence the system is more severely NOT about justice.. Just open borders.