← Autodidact Archive · Original Dissent · Hugh Lincoln
Thread ID: 10906 | Posts: 24 | Started: 2003-11-03
2003-11-03 18:54 | User Profile
And which are the best works of said composer?
And why did most of them come from Germanic areas of Europe circa the 1700s? Where was England in the 1800s or Italy in the 1600s?
And are there great classical composers today? Is this some art form frozen in time?
2003-11-07 04:20 | User Profile
To my mind Richard Wagner is unique and by far the greatest composer.
His definitive work - The Ring Of The Nibelungen (comprising :The Rhinegold, The Valkyrie, Siegfried and The Twilight Of The Gods) - in one massive and inspirational epic, is unsurpassed.
Of course Wagner's music must be heard. And to have the opportunity to attend a performance of 'The Ring' can be a life-changing experience.
German cultural feeling was expressed mostly through the musical form. Wagner is, without serious doubt, the culmination and zenith of German artistic expressive culture - if that terminology can be applied today.
Nothing has followed or challenged Wagner.
2003-11-07 04:40 | User Profile
In my personal opinion Beethoven was the best classical composer, him or Mozart. As for Wagner, I like his operas too. I especially like "Tannhauser". But I don't think he was the greatest.
Other favorites of mine are the Russian composers Tchaikovsky, Borodin, Mussogorsky, and Rimsky-Korsakov. I also like Handel, Bach, Hadyn, Vivaldi, and Shubert.
As for Classical music being an art form stuck in time, well actually no but you hardly hear about the composers today(epsecially when compared to the crap artists on MTV). You really would have to be an insider to know that. But my classical music tastes seem to be stuck in time to the Baroque, Neo-Classical, and early Romantic eras. I really don't care for most classical music written after those eras. :yucky:
2003-11-07 06:09 | User Profile
That is very hard to say as several composers are fantastic. I also am a big fan of classical Indian music (mostly Northern and Hindustani stuff) but I assume that HL means European music.
I like Florentine music of the 14th century so I am inclined towards Franceso Landini and his works Ecco laPrimavera, Lamento di Tristan and Lorenzo di Firenzeââ¬â¢s Da. Da chi Avareggia.
Ancient music by Hassler (ex. Lustgaten), anything by Michael Praetorius is excellent as is Phaleseââ¬â¢s ââ¬ÅPrimier Livre de Danseries and of course Guillaume de Marchautââ¬â¢s Rose, Liz, Printemps and Douce Dame Jolie are charming.
In terms of more modern stuff Bach correctly praised my possible favorite Dietrich Buxtehude whose The New Consort is one of the best trio sonatas of the late 1600's or early 1700's. I am also partial Uccelliniââ¬â¢s Sonatas and Johann Frobergerââ¬â¢s works for Harpsichord.
2003-11-07 20:05 | User Profile
I've always been fond of Beethoven, but I like Vivaldi, Mozart and Bach, also. Though he's used in the mainstream overmuch, Karl Orff is fun to listen to.
2003-11-07 21:12 | User Profile
[QUOTE=AntiYuppie]To me, the question "who was the BEST classical composer" means which composer had the most impact on musical history or had the most impressive body of work. In this regard, the answer would have to be Johann Sebastian Bach, followed by Ludwig van Beethoven.
I can agree with this!
2003-11-09 16:38 | User Profile
Mozart's Requiem Mass.
It's the greatest work ever composed, bar absolutely none.
I'm also very fond of Beethoven's Seventh Symphony.
Walter
2003-11-10 02:00 | User Profile
Wagner is where great music begins. Wagner is power - emotive power and strength. And as such remains unchallenged.
He has had the greatest effect on the greater number of people than any other composer - then or now. Every ambitious conductor aspires to Wagner and it is an unconditional aspiration. More than anything it is inspirational.
Technically, he overturned the world of opera, and has no equal. Genius is a term genuinely applicable to Wagner.
But it can come down to a matter of individual taste. I can appreciate Peter Tchaikovsky, Johann Strauss, Rimsky-Korsakov and Puccini, but it is with Wagner that the story starts and ends.
Richard Wagner, then perhaps, Beethoven. After that nobody.
2003-11-10 02:16 | User Profile
[QUOTE=Mentzer]Wagner is where great music begins. Wagner is power - emotive power and strength. And as such remains unchallenged.
He has had the greatest effect on the greater number of people than any other composer - then or now. Every ambitious conductor aspires to Wagner and it is an unconditional aspiration. More than anything it is inspirational.
Technically, he overturned the world of opera, and has no equal. Genius is a term genuinely applicable to Wagner.
But it can come down to a matter of individual taste. I can appreciate Peter Tchaikovsky, Johann Strauss, Rimsky-Korsakov and Puccini, but it is with Wagner that the story starts and ends.
Richard Wagner, then perhaps, Beethoven. After that nobody.[/QUOTE]
Didn't you already say all this?
2003-11-10 02:40 | User Profile
I also added something else. Did you miss it?
My Regards.
2003-11-11 03:19 | User Profile
Well,I enjoy instrumental music but my tastes veer more towards rock. While I enjoy the classics, I'm not really well-enough versed in them to offer a meaningful opinion. But I do like certain composers whose work sort of seized me by the lapels and shook me the first time I heard them (the way I'd respond to great rock music, come to think of it): Tchaikovsky, Brahms, Prokofiev, Wagner, Mozart. I look forward to further 'assaults' as I grow older and investigate further.
For classical music to
2003-11-12 04:00 | User Profile
By no means do I consider Anton Bruckner to be the "greatest composer", but his Fourth Symphony is my favorite classical work. It should also be of interest to all the Wagner-philes here. Bruckner was a great admirer of Wagner, and the Fourth Symphony sounds like the greatest work Wagner never wrote.
2003-11-15 21:58 | User Profile
[QUOTE=AntiYuppie]Bruckner is also one of my favorites (especially his symphonies 5,8,9), though I must also disagree with the statement that his music "sounds like Wagner." He certainly learned a great deal from Wagner about chromatic harmony and the use of heavy brass in orchestration, but there are virtually no passages in any of Bruckner's symphonies that could be mistaken from an orchestral score by Wagner. [/QUOTE]
All good points, and I can't really argue with you,
BUT (you knew that was coming)
I can't shake the feeling that the 4th symphony sounds Wagnerian. Certainly in the orchestration, but also its thematic material, which sounds like something that should be played at Bayreuth.
[QUOTE]Furthermore, Bruckner and Wagner had entirely different instinct and wanted to say different things. Even in quasi-Christian works such as Parsifal, it is clear that for Wagner the appeal of religion was purely aesthetic and symbolic, while Bruckner was entirely orthodox in his faith and put that faith into music.[/QUOTE]
How true. Bruckner was a devout Catholic, while Wagner was a devout Wagnerian.
2003-11-17 08:29 | User Profile
Hello all,
So then...the question regarding the "best" classical composer...
As a man who has spent the principle part of his "playing" life in the horn section of the Staatskapelle Dresden (1963-2000), my answer would involve one and only one criterion: which of all my breaths has been my favorite?
And I'm [I]still[/I] breathing.......
I am looking forward to engaging in dialogue with other members of O.D. who are friendly toward classical music.
Alles Gute
2003-11-17 08:40 | User Profile
Hilfe!!
I cannot find the procedure required to change the [I]color[/I] of my user name.
The red is terrible and I can't recall setting it up to be red. Will someone lend assistance?
Danke
2003-11-17 08:49 | User Profile
[QUOTE=nemmok riw]Hilfe!!
I cannot find the procedure required to change the [I]color[/I] of my user name.
The red is terrible and I can't recall setting it up to be red. Will someone lend assistance?
Danke[/QUOTE]
There is no procedure, nemmok, but make 15 posts and it will change. I promise.
2003-11-17 12:08 | User Profile
[QUOTE=nemmok riw]Hello all, So then...the question regarding the "best" classical composer... As a man who has spent the principle part of his "playing" life in the horn section of the Staatskapelle Dresden (1963-2000), my answer would involve one and only one criterion: which of all my breaths has been my favorite?
And I'm [I]still[/I] breathing....... Alles Gute[/QUOTE]
This brings to mind something that a famous classical musician whose identity I can't recall wrote years ago - it was either a director or a soloist. He said he would rather perform in concert in Germany than anyplace else in the world. He said there were music lovers the world over, but for Germans, music was as essential as air and water; the hall during the performance was unearthly still, as the listeners strained to absorb every note. I doubt that non-classical-music-lovers understand the intense attention and concentration that goes into listening to classical music. It's a true out-of-body experience, no matter how many thousands of times you've listened to the same piece before.
JW
2003-11-17 21:03 | User Profile
Hello (Fr.) Jean West,
Thank you for your kind remarks regarding classical music listening audiences in Germany.
I find myself hurrying to add to your words the name of the Russian audiences.
Russians, like the Germans, take in music from the soil and water of the Russian Motherland from the time they are born.
During my life with the Staatskapelle Dresden, many times we have played with the conductors and solo virtuosi from Russia. It was always a joy. They are so dedicated and thankful to play the music.
When we tour the Soviet Union the audiences are wonderful. It is like they are in church.
What is most wondeful is (1) their firendship toward we Germans (2) they do not hold the wars of our fathers and grandfathers against us.
I have many firends in Russian orchestras. I miss them. America is strange. My family is here but my heart is not. I think maybe I will go back to Dresden or maybe to Saint Petersburg or Moscow.
Alles Gute
2003-11-18 03:03 | User Profile
nemmok riw
Oh yes?
And who are you trying to fool, sonny?
Be very careful, commissar Hundsfott!
Mentzer.
2003-11-18 20:13 | User Profile
Mentzer,
I am no sonny...I have grandchildren.
I have never heard of commisar hundsfoot
You are sadly in error of your facts.
By the way, "nemmok riw" is the retrograde form of "wir kommen."
2003-11-20 00:34 | User Profile
Ich verstehe. Tadellos! Und Sie? Verstehan Sie? Es ist Sie, das in der Störung ist.
It is good that Dresden has been returned to the Fatherland - we will keep it that way - correct?
Mentzer.
2003-11-21 01:55 | User Profile
Erstaunt, Mentzer, nur erstaunt. Nichts mehr.
And yes! Let us hope to keep DRESDEN a part of Germany forever.
One learns not to invade the East. All it does is to pull back into itself and allow its size and weather to do the rest.
2003-11-21 02:29 | User Profile
Interesting that you have exposed yourself so very easily. That indicates something to me.
However, I waste no further time with you, commissar Hundsfott!
Mentzer.
2003-11-21 04:25 | User Profile
[B]YIPPEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEE[U]!!!!!
Pathetic. :disgust: