(Poll) Do you lean towards Turkey or Israel?

3 posts

Angocachi

He is Neo-Ottoman, his visit with Sheik Sharif Ahmed reaffirmed that. Hamas is ready to roll the red carpet out to him a way that has Ahmadinejad and Assad stunned. Lebanon loves his backing over coastal energy resources. He's making allies out of Democratic Islamists wherever he can find them, whether in power or opposition. Even the Islamist Kurds speak kindly of him in hopes he'll prove an aid against the neo-Marxist Kurds. His anti-Sino-Russian outlook and pan-Turkic sentimentalism gives him allies from the Tarim Basin to the Caspian, to the Urals and Caucasus. South Korea, Japan, Taiwan, Georgia, North Cyprus, Tunisia, Libya, Egypt, Poland, Ukraine, Azerbaijan, Pakistan all fall naturally on his side.
Israel can make a lot of allies out of this but not those tied to Tehran, and as long as they remain a fat leech on America's neck not those tied to Moscow either. Greece is nice but broke. Armenia is far more vulnerable. The PKK is afraid it'll lose domestic support if it flirts with Zionists (who represent evil Capitalist Western Imperialism among the leftist Kurds), and witnessing the fate of the South Lebanon Army, is it really smart?

SweetLeftFoot

Angocachi nailing shit like a professional footballer at a post-club party.

President Camacho
This is key.

Nic I remember in shoutbox you stated that Israel without American aid is just an unimportant shetl, while Turkey is a regional hegemon. I disagree at least so far as Israel is concerned. While losing American backing would certainly be devastating, Israel (at least currently) is a first-rate state in military terms, as it possesses nuclear capabilities and a modern air force. Turkey is not a first-rate state.

The net effect of Turkey flexing its economic muscle would most likely be reducing the number of immigrants streaming across the Bosphorus in search of greener pastures, which is a positive.

Combine this with the fact that no matter how much Neo-Ottoman fervor Turkey whips up under upstarts like Erdogan, it remains largely observant to the rules of "international law" and deferent to the vital interests of global powers. Western nations can also employ historic rivals like Egypt or Iran to counter Turkey's strategic ambitions and keep it contained.

The modern Jewish State, on the other hand, has truly taken up Dayan's advice and transformed itself into "A mad dog, too dangerous to bother". It stands completely outside of modern political norms and is becoming increasingly isolated and desperate, and hence its behavior is becoming even more spasmodic and unpredictable.

If the question is to be taken as "Which of these 2 states should the West support if a conflict arose between them", then I would pick Turkey, as abandoning Israel to fend for itself is the only way to bring it down to earth.